Adwords cost per click

[deepsand]

Especially to apwade and stuart6mac: I'm not trying to defend Google nor attempting to discount your sense of frustration, but I'm reminded of the cliche that "we are underlings" -- and this is perhaps one of the truths when it comes to the relationship between we mere mortals and the Google Gods.
In any case, if your per click rates are going up, there are a number of reasons. The main one is certainly rooted in the supply and demand situation: the more people bidding for a given keyword (or expression), the more the price will rise. But, just as likely, there's the Google built in idea -- whether you like or agree with it or not -- of encouraging you to work on what they call your Quality Score. Nefertiti's explanations may seem (and no doubt are) difficult to understand, but, if you'll allow me to say so, she's telling you what you need to hear, even though it seems to not be what you want to be told.
Nevertheless, she's undoubtedly correct in suggesting that if you want to see your cost per click go down, your answer lies in pushing up the focus/relevancy of your keyword(s). For instance, while you may think that "book about a cat" is sufficiently specific, you have only to realize how many of its kind exist. It has to run in the hundreds or even tens of hundreds, so why should Google's favour shine upon you? You're simply one of a fair sized crowd, are you not?
Not being aware of your product or its content, to say nothing of the exact wording of your AdWord or the precise choice of keyword(s), I can't begin to suggest where the potential improvement lies. However, if I'm to be teased by your ad, my click on it needs to be triggered by a whole lot more than "a book about a cat." I need to be intrigued about connecting with a cat that talks to people, a cat that loves mice, a cat that can count up to 555, a cat that has 19 lives rather than the usual nine ones, etc., etc., ad nauseum. In other words, I want to be told by your ad that "Heh, here's something you don't know / may not be aware of / can have you laughing your head off / bursting into tears / etc., etc., ad nauseum."
In other words, you gotta be different and stand out from the crowd if your ad is to pull the way Google thinks it should. Think about this, really think about it, and then have the courage to recognize that the fault lies not with Google, but with you (and other frustrated souls) because, ahem, we are underlings!!

Duncan

This still begs the question as to why the minimum bid should be different for different advertisers in an auction system.

Such is clearly discriminatory. What cogent argument is there for the justification for such?

[SisterSledge]

"This still begs the question as to why the minimum bid should be different for different advertisers in an auction system.

Such is clearly discriminatory. What cogent argument is there for the justification for such?"


Simple...Google displays ads with the user in mind...not the advertiser. If someone wants to advertise with a crappy irrelevant or poorly worded ad, they will pay more for that privilege and hopefully be discouraged from said practice.

[oiboi]

I cannot believe there is a defense for the Google revenue systems - whether it is Adwords or Adsense…unless you are caught up in this shady way of making a living. Their system is wide open to scams and fraud, is stupidly complicated, and has caused the internet to flood with worthless sites running page after page of ads. There is no doubt in my way of thinking (which tends to be honest and forthright - and ethical) that this system has only Google in mind - not the searcher - that is for certain. It has become more and more difficult to get to what you are really after when doing searches for specific items. Do you pay attention to what comes up for ads when you are trying to find something specific?

I think if I was a searching for a children’s book about a cat - which I’m guessing does happen, I certainly would be delighted to see Stuart’s ad pop up with just the words he expected me to use.

Why does Google need to worry if Stuart’s ad does not appear very often? Is it taking up space in the Cosmos? Is some other ad waiting to take Stuart’s ad’s place? For goodness sake, exactly how much does it cost Google to store Stuart’s ad until someone types in “book about cat”. Stuart was as exacting as he could be to avoid wasted $$’s on worthless clicks. Makes perfect sense to me.

The Google system exists for Google - and because of these sleazy methods, the internet has been inundated with worthless sites full of advertising and rant with fraudulent clicks.

And we’re back to my original question:
So why can’t Google just sell ad space for x-dollars like a newspaper does?

[Martinscholes]

And we’re back to my original question:
So why can’t Google just sell ad space for x-dollars like a newspaper does?

There would be potential problems with this idea.

For example, Google sells a small advert that links to the site of the advertiser. Ad space in newspapers would not be the same as ad space on someone else's website.

And selling advertising space in newspapers is NOT as simple as you might think.

For example, everyone does NOT pay the same price for the same amount of space in a newspaper or magazine advert.

If someone specifically wants -say- fourth right hand page, they would pay a massive premium for that. But if someone asks for an advert ROP (Run of Paper) because they don't care where it goes, they'll pay less.

And if the advertiser who specifies the fourth right hand page suddenly pulls out at the last minute, some poor soul in sales will have to frantically phone round their contacts trying to sell that space at a hefty discount.

[deepsand]

"This still begs the question as to why the minimum bid should be different for different advertisers in an auction system.

Such is clearly discriminatory. What cogent argument is there for the justification for such?"


Simple...Google displays ads with the user in mind...not the advertiser. If someone wants to advertise with a crappy irrelevant or poorly worded ad, they will pay more for that privilege and hopefully be discouraged from said practice.

That fails to address the question re. the minimum bid & ingnores the fact that, like any publisher, Google has editorial control over both the acceptance of the listings & the content of the ads.

Furthermore, as I've earlier noted, Google's "minimum" bids for a give keyword for a given advertiser change from day to day, with no action on the part of the advertiser.

I've seen numerous case where a) the keywords were proper in all regards; b) the site's content was wholly relevant to said keywords; c) the amount bid was low enough so as to guarantee a low position in the display list; d) the "minimum" demanded was far above the current market for said keyword; and, e) the advertiser left the bid unchanged, with the result that, within several days, the listing was activated by Google.

Google's actions re. "minimum" bids are clearly arbitrary, capricious & discriminatory. Were their's a regulated industry, they would be exceedingly hard pressed to defend against an equity suit claiming such actions on their part.

Google's actions are not taken for the pleasure of the "user," but rather for that of Google. That is the primary objective of any business.

[oiboi]

Newspaper want ads are simple - simply go on line, fill out a form for a heading and text, and pay for it, usually for the number of words (space used). The "link", so to speak is the phone number or other contact information. There are usually bargain rates for certain categories, and higher rates for others like real estate. There are even "Thrifty" sections for items of lesser value. Often, if you pay more, your ad will appear in more than one publication widening its distribution.

Display ads are priced per size (column inch), page location, and page area - a whole different matter, but also not a difficult price structure and it is a UNIFORM price structure, although regular advertisers can get better rates. Normally, the standard rates are published, so there are no surprises. These are usually contracted terms and although one can pull one's ad, the bill still must be paid.

I'm simply saying that if no one calls you, perhaps no one likes what you have to offer, or no one is impressed by your ad. If you don't get results, you the advertiser, not the publisher, dictates any changes necessary, and the publisher does not arbitrarily make the advertiser pay more because no one looked at your ad, or someone looked at your ad but did not call (link to) you.

[deepsand]

Newspaper want ads are simple - simply go on line, fill out a form for a heading and text, and pay for it, usually for the number of words (space used). The "link", so to speak is the phone number or other contact information. There are usually bargain rates for certain categories, and higher rates for others like real estate. There are even "Thrifty" sections for items of lesser value. Often, if you pay more, your ad will appear in more than one publication widening its distribution.

Display ads are priced per size (column inch), page location, and page area - a whole different matter, but also not a difficult price structure and it is a UNIFORM price structure, although regular advertisers can get better rates. Normally, the standard rates are published, so there are no surprises. These are usually contracted terms and although one can pull one's ad, the bill still must be paid.

I'm simply saying that if no one calls you, perhaps no one likes what you have to offer, or no one is impressed by your ad. If you don't get results, you the advertiser, not the publisher, dictates any changes necessary, and the publisher does not arbitrarily make the advertiser pay more because no one looked at your ad, or someone looked at your ad but did not call (link to) you.

Although newsprint publishers do have a published Rate Card, their rates are not fixed, but are in fact negotiable.

It is this fact which gave rise to Google Print Ads.

[Duncan Pollock]

To oiboi and those of like mind:
SisterSledge hits the nail on the head when she observes "Simple...Google displays ads with the user in mind...not the advertiser. If someone wants to advertise with a crappy irrelevant or poorly worded ad, they will pay more for that privilege and hopefully be discouraged from said practice."

The point you're not recognizing, oiboi, is that YOU are attempting to compare apples with apples when the reality is that GOOGLE is preoccupied with sorting out apples, oranges, lemons, etc., etc. No two ads (or, at least, very few that on the surface seem similar in nature or purpose) are truly comparable. They all have Quality Score differences and THIS is what governs Google decisions.
With all due respect, if you aren't prepared to look at things from Google's point of view -- as opposed to your own -- you're going to continue being frustrated.
With even more due respect, perhaps you should give some thought to the old saying that "There are none so blind as those who will not see."
Yes? Yes!!

Duncan

[deepsand]

To oiboi and those of like mind:
SisterSledge hits the nail on the head when she observes "Simple...Google displays ads with the user in mind...not the advertiser. If someone wants to advertise with a crappy irrelevant or poorly worded ad, they will pay more for that privilege and hopefully be discouraged from said practice."

The point you're not recognizing, oiboi, is that YOU are attempting to compare apples with apples when the reality is that GOOGLE is preoccupied with sorting out apples, oranges, lemons, etc., etc. No two ads (or, at least, very few that on the surface seem similar in nature or purpose) are truly comparable. They all have Quality Score differences and THIS is what governs Google decisions.
With all due respect, if you aren't prepared to look at things from Google's point of view -- as opposed to your own -- you're going to continue being frustrated.
With even more due respect, perhaps you should give some thought to the old saying that "There are none so blind as those who will not see."
Yes? Yes!!

Duncan

What you say sounds nice in theory; but, in practice, that's not what's happening.

Please see my prior posts re. Google's arbitrary, capricious & discriminatory behavior re. "minimum" bids; i.e. they are not consistent even from day to day re. the same keywords, the same ads, and the same advertiser! That's apples & apples, oranges & oranges, artichokes & artichokes.

Google is in business, for their gain, not that of the "user." Their goal is to maximize their revenues, by any & all available means.

"In theory, there's no difference between theory & practice; in practice, there's a world of difference."

[JohneeMac]

Nefertiti: You can increase your Quality Score and lower your minimum bid by choosing highly targeted keywords and writing relevant ad text.
Stuart: Look I want to advertise a book - NOT take a degree in how to work with Google

A little off topic, and no disrespect to you Stuart, but your line there frustrates me a little.

Google Adwords isnt some kids toy that you can just put a few dollars on a day and sell your book 100's of times over within that budget. Its a professional system that makes some people (through Adsense) thousands of pounds/ $ a day.

It seems like you arent willing to put the effort in to learn little bit about it. A few hours reading a night for a week and you would have a firm grasp of how to get results using it. People and many on the board would charge 100s and 1000s for professional PPC services, and for good reason, they know what they are doing.

Sure there are flaws to it and it could be set up better, no question, but its still a tool that can bring huge traffic and sales to most sites. It certainly could be set up easier for new businesses and people to market their product but once again this isnt some second rate shop corner shop.