is DMOZ serious in being open?!

[honarparvar]

Hi all, I attempted to become an ODP editor 3 months ago. I filled the application carefully, with real and relevant URLs and other stuff. by the way I got a disapprove email in less than an hour from noreply at dmoz dot org with no reviewer comments.
maybe my english is week, or maybe the reason is I live in Iran. but by the way there are lots of problems in dmoz listings (specially in world category) and many sections seem to have no editor. I tried to list some of my persian and english websites but all of them failed.
please advise. warm regards,
Emad Honarparvar

emad[at]irxp.com
http://www.honarparvar.com

[cbp]

DMOZ accepts > several 100 new editors a month. If english is not your first language, then ths could have easily been the reason, as suggested descviptions could not have been guideline compliant. Another common reason for a quick rejection is the size and nature of the category applied for. Living in Iran would have had nothing to do with it.

BTW - the "open" in open directory is because its based on the open source movement. ie DMOZ makes it database availalbe. It is not "open" to list all sites (<25% of submitted sites are listable).

What category did you apply for?

CBP

[Psychobel]

From our point of view DMOZ is a waste of time. We have requests for inclusion over 2 years old. We have attenpted to become editors of un edited sections where we have the knowledge and experience.

It may be a voluntary thing, but it is a very badly run voluntary thing and that makes it dangerous.

[cbp]

We have requests for inclusion over 2 years old.

You seem to misunderstand that DMOZ is some sort of listing service for webmasters. You do not request an inclusion....you make a suggestion that an editor may or may not use when building a catgeory.

We have attenpted to become editors of un edited sections where we have the knowledge and experience.

There are no unedited sections.

but it is a very badly run voluntary thing

If its so badly run, how come it has grown into the largest and fastest growing directory?

CBP

[Psychobel]

We have requests for inclusion over 2 years old.

You seem to misunderstand that DMOZ is some sort of listing service for webmasters. You do not request an inclusion....you make a suggestion that an editor may or may not use when building a catgeory.

We have attenpted to become editors of un edited sections where we have the knowledge and experience.

There are mo unedited sections.

CBP

No not at all. I think you deliberately misunderstand me. I am fully well aware of the process of being included in DMOZ. The fact remains that DMOZ has published processes which it clearly does not adhere to.

If valid suggestions are made which are not acted on in any way, what is the value in DMOZ?

for reference, here is a particular category in question

http://www.dmoz.org/Regional/Europe/United_Kingdom/
Business_and_Economy/Computers_and_Internet/Internet/
Internet_Service_Providers/Subscription-Free_Service/

[cbp]

No not at all. I think you deliberately misunderstand me. I am fully well aware of the process of being included in DMOZ. The fact remains that DMOZ has published processes which it clearly does not adhere to.

What exactly process is it not adhereing to? Is it just not meeting your listing/SEO needs (which is a service that it does not provide)

To avoid retyping, here is what I wrote in another thread and the role of a suggestion (it is slightly out of context:

That is only the case if you consider DMOZ to be some sort of listing service - its not... as such the concept of a "backlog" does not really exist.

There is only a "backlog" at DMOZ if you consider DMOZ to be a listing service and the editors role being to process submissions - it is neither. Most critics and that author consider DMOZ to be a listing service ...they need to get over that. Many other directories provide that service. I fail to understand why so many complain about something that is not provided by DMOZ.

An editors role is to build a category of useful resources. The role is not to list every possible site on the topic of the category and its not to process submissions. Submitting a site is nothing more than a suggestion for the editor to consider (and editors are free to totally ignore all submissions, though most do not.)

To build a category an editor uses the following resources (for eg):
1. Personal knowledge
2. Following links on sites already listed and not listed
3. Searching Google and Yahoo, etc
4. Google alerts
5. Print advertisments; signs on trucks etc
6. Submmitted sites
7. Industry publications
8. etc

By submitting sites, you are doing nothing more than providing another means of assistance for a editor to find good sites. The problem is that the submitted sites is the worst source of good sites and is the most inefficient way for an editor to build a category. The best sites are probably never submitted (not every one has heard of DMOZ!) - they have just as much right to be considered for a listing to build a category of good resources as any site submitted. As they were not submitted, they are just a bit harder to find.

From this point of view the "backlog" at DMOZ is an irrelavant concept. The "backlog" really consists of the entire www of sites not listed.

DMOZ is NOT a listing service for webmasters. That servce is provided by a lot of other directories

and to further clarify it, here is a post from oneeye over at RZ

The main thing that is wrong with the submission system is that for some reason people get the wrong idea about what it is. They think it is a service for them to get their site listed when all they have done is made a suggestion and they believe the suggestions made via the link are (or should be) a priority, when it is just one of a dozen methods by which editors find sites. The fault lies in not ensuring that the correct message is reinforced at the time someone suggests an URL using language that is not only unambiguous but makes it clear that it is not a webmaster service but a pitch by a potential supplier of material, i.e. the submitter is not a customer; the directory is the customer and the webmaster the supplier. It is clear there are people who are not getting that message from the current wording and changing it can do nothing but good. Of course agreeing a wording everyone likes is never easy...

http://resource-zone.com/forum/showt...388#post205388

Regarding the category you listed, there are 77 sites there --- that looks like a good resource of surfers ...of what increased value would 78 sites be? Looks like it was last updated a few week ago. New sites for listing in that category would have to have more to offer then sites already listed there.

BTW, I justpicked up this comment from donaldB over at RZ:

In December we actually accepted 288 new editors. November was 292, and October was 515

http://resource-zone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41918&page=2

CBP

[ADAM Web Design]

If its so badly run, how come it has grown into the largest and fastest growing directory?

CBP

Size doesn't necessarily equal efficiency in operation (or for that matter, ethical operation).

Three examples:

Enron
WorldCom/MCI
Bell Canada (and anyone who has ever had phone issues in the Great White North knows EXACTLY what I'm talking about)

Just something to think about.

[cbp]

Size doesn't necessarily equal efficiency in operation (or for that matter, ethical operation)

Good point.

Maybe I should have been cynical and paraphrased it as I think DMOZ is badly run as its failing to meet my SEO needs

CBP

[honarparvar]

Thanks for all advices. first let me tell I applied again and this time I didn't recieve a fast rejection! (good sign!) the previous category I'd applied was a regional category (World:Farsi:اخبار[news])

I respect DMOZ not for its sclae, but for its approach. yes, size does not matter always.
Emad

[MrLeN]

If DMOZ is making tens of thousands of people upset, then maybe it isn't such a wonderful service after all.

If you ask me, DMOZ is doomed to failure unless they write some better back end systems and get things running in a more timely manner.

I rarely hear anything good said about DMOZ, other that it's apparently "Good to get into". Yeah, if you don't mind waiting 15 years.

Useless.

MrLeN