sandbox and competitors

[starboard1]

Hi
I've been reading up on the sandbox theory, one of the suggestions as to what triggers this feature is if a site gains an excessive amount of back links too quickly.
My problem with this is that I attended the SES conference in June this year, and a speaker from Google said that it was not possible to damage another companies rankings, for example by linking to them from blacklisted/spam sites.
So my question is, what is stopping a company from hindering a competitor's new website by linking to them from let's say every one of it's 1000 pages of it's own website.
Obviously it's not a great long term strategy, but seems to be a flaw in that part of the theory.
I'd be interested in your comments.

[wavedancing]

I am new to the sandbox theory. If I understand you correctly, you are saying if I point to my competitor's site at everypage of one of my site (more than 1000 papes index by google), my competitor's site will be sandboxed. I think it might not work for old sites. It might really work for new sites. But for your new competitors, is there a need to do so?

[cbp]

We have no idea if the sandbox is or is not triggered by getting too many links too quickly.

CBP

[iamrussell]

I think it's a blanket devaluation of new sites regardless of any SEO.

[starboard1]

I am new to the sandbox theory. If I understand you correctly, you are saying if I point to my competitor's site at everypage of one of my site (more than 1000 papes index by google), my competitor's site will be sandboxed. I think it might not work for old sites.

Well I have read in some threads that suddenly gaining a huge amount of backlinks would been seen as being "unnatural" in Google's eyes, and could damage your rankings. This probably isn't sandbox related. But if it's true it would be possible to blast a site with hundreds of links and them do them damage. So it makes me think it probably isn't true.

It might really work for new sites. But for your new competitors, is there a need to do so?

Some people would think so. But it wasn't a case of whether you need to or not, just whether you could? The fact that you probably could if the theory was true makes me think that the theory probably isn't true.

[cbp]

Well I have read in some threads that suddenly gaining a huge amount of backlinks would been seen as being "unnatural" in Google's eyes, and could damage your rankings.

Just because you read it dosen't make it true. I have seen some speculation that Google could do this if they want to. Speculating that Google could do this as one of many theories to explain the sandbox or poor rankings, does not mean that Google are actually doing it. I have yet to see evidence it happens - if anything I have seen the opposite happen - ie rankings jump up (for non-sandoxed sites) after obtaining 1000's of non-relevant backlinks in very short time span (eg look what has happened with Digitalpoints co-op network)

CBP

[Outdoor Maniac]

Hello,

So if your site is gone for some listings on Google it is called sandboxed ?.

I would call it, wrong place wrong time results.

Maybe google have multiple servers and they all select websites for different marks, I mean one server index internet on keywords another one for headers, and another one for links and another for text content,

So on all servers the search results will be different because every website is different.

it depents on wich google server the results will display to you.

It would be logical if google uses the servers where is almost no traffic late night or
early morning, to avoid long waiting/search times.

And probably your search result will come from an asian server where is less traffic, if that server index on headers and content then it could be possible that your website isnt in the listing, but if you try a few hours later then its back again.

Maybe I am totally wrong but I just follow the way of logic

best regards
Outdoor Maniac

[cbp]

So if your site is gone for some listings on Google it is called sandboxed ?.

No.

There is a big difference between "the sandbox" and "ranking poorly" - most sites I have looked at that claim to be sandboxed, just rank poorly.

IMHO, a sandboxed site is:
1) New domain - probably since March or so of this year
2) On page SEO is OK, but not overdone
3) Good number of links, esp with keyword(s) in anchor text
4) Googlebot crawls often
5) Most/many pages are indexed
6) Ranks well for obscure terms
7) Ranks very well for the allins for main keyword (important criteria)
8) Does not rank in top 700 or so for term that its optimized for.
9) Absence of anything that could attract a penalty.

CBP

[activeco]

So my question is, what is stopping a company from hindering a competitor's new website by linking to them from let's say every one of it's 1000 pages of it's own website.

That would be simply not counted towards rankings, so the legitimate links would remain the same.

[Tamera Billings]

Hi cbp,

I am new to website developement and I could use some help.

My site fits most of what you describe as a sandboxed site. It has been online since the middle of September.

My questions are:

What determines whether SEO is overdone or ok?

As far as I know my site has no ranking for ANY terms with google. How do I find this out for sure?

What are allins for main keyword?

How do I know [other than major penalties] what attracts a penalty from google?


2) On page SEO is OK, but not overdone
6) Ranks well for obscure terms
7) Ranks very well for the allins for main keyword (important criteria)
9) Absence of anything that could attract a penalty.

My site is
http://www.pinelakedistribution.com

Please take a look and let me know if it is a dead site or not.

Any help would be a God send.
Thanks