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Thread: Stop words that are keywords

  1. #1
    Senior Member craigmn3's Avatar
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    Stop words that are keywords

    What is the best way to deal with stop words for keywords

    specifically in this case : Above Ground Pools

    A very specific keyword and market....but the word "Above" is a stop word and not recognized by google as a keyword , even in the web master tools

    There are derivations like on the ground pools...but very few people search that. Where as above ground pools is the leading search term for this product

    Since everyone is dealing with the same issue should I just focus on "ground Pools" or is there another way to go?

  2. #2
    Administrator weegillis's Avatar
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    Hyphenating would cure this, I suspect. Above-ground is not improper. It makes a perfect adjective.

  3. #3
    Rest in Peace 1946 - 2013 deepsand's Avatar
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    Just because WMT doesn't show something doesn't mean that it's a "stop" word. In fact, there is no absolute definition of such, as it's quite context sensitive.

    While the latter yields slightly more results, searches for above ground pools and above-ground pools yield nearly identical first page results.

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    Try to think of as many common synonyms for "above" as you can. Also, try to think of more ways to describe an above ground pool. People looking for an above ground pool may not know the correct term to describe such a thing is "above ground pool" and may refer to it as something else. Try "yard pool" "fiberglass pool" "constructable pool," etc. Visit a competitor's website and see if they call an above ground pool by another name.

    Another thing you might try is to list "ground pool above" or "pool ground above" as keywords. Placing "above" last might allow search engines to find you faster because you don't place the stop word first. If they do include a search for "above" at least you'll have it in there.

  5. #5
    Rest in Peace 1946 - 2013 deepsand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by antihero13 View Post
    Try to think of as many common synonyms for "above" as you can. Also, try to think of more ways to describe an above ground pool. People looking for an above ground pool may not know the correct term to describe such a thing is "above ground pool" and may refer to it as something else. Try "yard pool" "fiberglass pool" "constructable pool," etc. Visit a competitor's website and see if they call an above ground pool by another name.
    What advantage might be had by abandoning the very most common phrase?


    Quote Originally Posted by antihero13 View Post
    Another thing you might try is to list "ground pool above" or "pool ground above" as keywords. Placing "above" last might allow search engines to find you faster because you don't place the stop word first. If they do include a search for "above" at least you'll have it in there.
    Given that very few users employ exact search, so that all 6 permutations of the 3 words are equal, and that Google now frequently ignores users command to use exact search, why try to force strange permutations, such as "pool ground above" into on-page content?

  6. The following user agrees with deepsand:
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    Quote Originally Posted by deepsand View Post
    Just because WMT doesn't show something doesn't mean that it's a "stop" word. In fact, there is no absolute definition of such, as it's quite context sensitive.
    You can say that again. I was just about thinking of the same thing, although webmasters' minds might be filled with ideas about some stop words, but using them might not seem that bad after all and presence or absence of terms on members panels might not reveal anything.

    Sometimes I just assume there is nothing like stop words because it seems illogical, assuming that presence of some terms, either as parts of links or parts of titles of the pages could damage their placements online. Using a hyphen seems to be a smart move, and Google uses its own thesaurus to examine the terms, no wonder similar and even identical results appear online when you use a it with or without a hyphen.

  8. #7
    Rest in Peace 1946 - 2013 deepsand's Avatar
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    That Google has indexed the presence of a word on a page stands to attest to the fact that it is not there deemed to be a "stop" word.

  9. #8
    Administrator weegillis's Avatar
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    From what I can deduce from the above, it is all a question of why your 'above ground pool's are not being chosen ahead of the rest. Since there are no stop words, all I can see is they (SE's) are not seeing enough context from your pages to string these three words together for your site with any rank. Order would be of no consequence, imho. Only difference prevails. A hyphen is different from a space though it reads the same. Try ranking for that and work at pulling up the socks on the other in the meantime.
    Last edited by weegillis; 05-06-2012 at 09:39 PM. Reason: yup, rephrasing...

  10. #9
    Rest in Peace 1946 - 2013 deepsand's Avatar
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    Not only does order of words not matter in the absence of an exact match search, neither does the presence of hyphens, as evidenced by a search for pools-above-ground.

  11. #10
    Senior Member ozsubasi's Avatar
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    One stop word is "for". My site is about real estate, so that it is (mytown) property for sale, i.e. it is the both the domain name and the main keyword. People do ask about what is "for sale" whether it is real estate, cars, sink plungers or anything else. So it seems inexplicable to me that such a common phrase (in my part of the world) contains a stop word.
    If I do a search for my keyword (including "for") then look at the cache for my site, the search terms for the search are highlighted, and "for" isn't one of them. But if I omitted it from my domain name or keyword, what was left wouldn't make sense.
    I have read the thread but I am tired and about to go home, so if I have missed a point please tell me and I will apologize tomorrow. But why would Google not include all words searched for when results are returned? Miss some out and the meaning can be changed.

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