View Full Version : Is Twitter Stealing Your Links?
mjtaylor
03-08-2010, 07:30 PM
In this provocative post (mentioned by kgun in another thread (http://www.webproworld.com/search-engine-optimization-forum/100223-page-search-engine-optimization-best-practices.html#post501032)) by Rand Fishkin of SEOMoz observes that bloggers are linking less often to articles that interest them. Instead they are Tweeting about them.
SEOmoz | Could Twitter Cannibalize the Web's Link Graph (http://www.seomoz.org/blog/could-twitter-cannibalize-the-webs-link-graph)
Do you feel it's tougher than ever, because of Twitter, to get quality links for your site? Will search engines have to start indexing Tweets in a whole new way to stay on top of the trends in information?
Yes, this is interesting
"Twitter is cannibalizing blogging. People who previously might have blogged about a site/news article/clever piece of linkbait are simply tweeting it, and save their blog posts for more comprehensive essays and broader subjects.
This last one is fascinating to me, and carries some interesting connotations. If the trend is real, and continues, it seems very likely to me that the search engines will need to start relying on Twitter's tweet graph, particularly for "new" information and content?"
So there is a new concept: Twitter's tweet graph
Googling the exaxt term "Twitter's tweet graph" give you at leas one related (comment) article.
Related WPW thread: http://www.webproworld.com/search-engine-optimization-forum/100489-twitter-improve-my-ranking.html#post501174
claybutler
03-09-2010, 04:50 PM
I don't see a lot of Tweet traffic but then again I'm not maximizing my tweeter feeds. I just can't be bothered with investing all the time that is necessary to get any serious traffic from it. I still think the really good (quality) traffic comes from other blogs, not tweets. The reason being is when a blogger links to me it is usually is surrounded by content that provides context and a reason for the link. Twitter post are just a bunch of short headlines with a stupid bitly link. Both of which tell you almost nothing about what this link is about. This devalues the link from a usability point of view.
I also believe that because it's so easy to tweet that the links are viewed with less gravity than say a blog link. If someone writes a good post and then highlights you with a link in the article that means something. Not only to SE's but to people as well. All referals aren't the same. If Robert Di Nero says you're a good actor that means a heck of a lot more than if your grandma says the same thing. Source matters.
No doubt that Digg and Tweets can help somehting go viral, but for most of us that simply won't happen. We need the meat and potatoes traffic.
I have no idea what the SE's will do about this since be default ALL links in social media are no follow and URL shorteners like bitly strip any reference to the original URL which often contains clues to what the page is about.
This is definitely going to make the SE's job harder at judging relevance and quality.
pedroneiraf
03-09-2010, 05:23 PM
I don't see a lot of Tweet traffic but then again I'm not maximizing my tweeter feeds. I just can't be bothered with investing all the time that is necessary to get any serious traffic from it. I still think the really good (quality) traffic comes from other blogs, not tweets. The reason being is when a blogger links to me it is usually is surrounded by content that provides context and a reason for the link. Twitter post are just a bunch of short headlines with a stupid bitly link. Both of which tell you almost nothing about what this link is about. This devalues the link from a usability point of view.
Don't fully agree with Claybutler. It's true, lot's of people use Twitter to stupid reasons, but that's not the only use there is. Just as you can get a link from a blog with completely unrelated content (that will be not very useful), you can get a link from a stupid tweet. But there's the other case as well. You mention that usually links from blogs are surrounded by related content.... What if the link your getting from Twitter comes from an expert in your field? i.e: An expert in SEO, links one of your posts from your SEO Blog? Shouldn't that be as valuable as a link from a blog with related content??
I think it should. With time, search engines will get to differentiate the value of Twitter links, just as they do differentiate the value of links from blogs, websites or anything else.
chrisJumbo
03-09-2010, 05:39 PM
Frankly, I haven't gone the twitter route. I realize it is huge and lots of people are using it, I'm just not convinced they are the "buyers" we would be looking for.
I can see how people might feel twitter is taking links, but I still find great content on blogs and and don't find much meat with twitter.
cd :O)
claybutler
03-09-2010, 05:45 PM
What if the link your getting from Twitter comes from an expert in your field? i.e: An expert in SEO, links one of your posts from your SEO Blog? Shouldn't that be as valuable as a link from a blog with related content??
I think it should. With time, search engines will get to differentiate the value of Twitter links, just as they do differentiate the value of links from blogs, websites or anything else.
I think it will matter somewhat but not as much as a link from the SEO experts blog. The reason is it's almost impossible to tell who's an expert on twitter because there is no content. No BBB seals, no real contact info, no pages of info, no whois info...nothing but a bunch of links. That is incredibly easy to fake because there is so little context and the price of admission is zero. Anything with a low barrier to entry is devalued. However a half way decent blog takes work. Sure you can use automation tricks and blog networks and try to fake it but it's much harder to pull off than another fake twitter account full of links. That's why I don't believe the SE's will ever place the same value on a twitter post as a blog post. They try to protect the quality of their search results as that is tied directly into their profits. That's why the keyword meta tag was mostly dropped or devalued. Too easy to fake and a low barrier to entry. I view twitter the same way. It's algorithmically to the SE's advantage to devalue the links because it's so easy to spoof. Not saying it won't count for something in the future but it doubt it will be counted the same way or even used the same way. More likely it will be used for trending data. That could be useful. However in the classic Google PR sense, I have my doubts.
netroact
03-09-2010, 06:53 PM
I've been hanging out on twitter lately, and I have come to see it as a valuable tool, both for linking to my own blog content, and finding links to other people's blog content. Almost every single tweet that has provided valuable information for me, is a link to a blog. And, most of my retweets are someone linking to some excellent article on a blog. You just can't share much information within the confines of a tweet. Maybe a few tidbits of info, but nothing of any substance.
And, due to the limited nature of a tweet, I really can't see this changing in the future. IDK, maybe it's the neighborhoods I hang out in, but I can't see any threat at all from twitter. In my experience I have noticed that whenever I tweet about a post on my blog, it's not long before googlebot shows up to have a look, nofollow or not.
claybutler
03-09-2010, 08:25 PM
In my experience I have noticed that whenever I tweet about a post on my blog, it's not long before googlebot shows up to have a look, nofollow or not.
I've been having the same weird indexing experienced as well. I don't know if it's because I Digg my own posts or that my blog post automatically post to my Twitter account but not only will a new blog post be indexed within minutes, but it will be ranking well for it's keyphrases too. And it's not a temporary blip either. It stays that way. It's kind of magical. Whatever I'm doing, it's working, but I don't know yet which factor is the trigger.
netroact
03-09-2010, 09:22 PM
....or that my blog post automatically post to my Twitter account but not only will a new blog post be indexed within minutes, but it will be ranking well for it's keyphrases too...
My blog posts are automatically tweeted as well via Bird Feeder. Maybe Google sees that as a third party tweeting a new post from the blog. And, maybe that gives it some juice.
I know one thing for sure, it's working for now.
mjtaylor
03-09-2010, 09:43 PM
In my experience I have noticed that whenever I tweet about a post on my blog, it's not long before googlebot shows up to have a look, nofollow or not.
You may well know this, but for those who don't, the nofollow attribute doesn't mean Google won't follow and index the linked site; it ONLY means Google won't allow any PageRank from the page where the site is linked.
netroact
03-09-2010, 10:40 PM
You may well know this, but for those who don't, the nofollow attribute doesn't mean Google won't follow and index the linked site; it ONLY means Google won't allow any PageRank from the page where the site is linked.
I actually learned that on these SEO forums at some point, even though I have always been confused about Pagerank anyway.
I was referring to Clay's post earlier about 2 negatives on social networking - nofollow and url shorteners. I'm just saying that it isn't really negative, because you can get some ranking juice when you tweet links to your blog posts, and other people retweet the links, and maybe even when these third party apps tweet your blog posts automatically.
Or, maybe something else is in play here altogether. Who really knows but Google? I know I'm gonna exploit it while I can, cuz it brings some good rankings in the SERPS.
That googlebot seems kinda creepy to me sometimes. Can't figure out where it's coming from or going to. Maybe some day it will get a mind of it's own, and hook up with the algorithms and take over the web. Maybe it already did!
netroact
03-09-2010, 10:48 PM
One more advantage on twitter is that you can ask for tweets and retweets, just like you would ask for a link. And, according to what I have been reading, that will provide some juice.
mjtaylor
03-10-2010, 12:54 AM
As far as I know there is no PageRank passed by Twitter posts.
Note:
Twitter is IMO like a live news header site.
Twitter is like an advanced news ticker with added functionality, e.g. sending an IM to your followers etc.
For that reason your short message should be meaningful, semantic.
I don't see how Twitter can supply stable semantic links.
So to the queston "Is Twitter Stealing Your Links?" I will answer No.
Note professional companies like Cnn are heavy Twitter users.
I don't know if you found the long video about Twitter on Social Media Examiner, Your Guide to the Social Media Jungle (http://www.socialmediaexaminer.com) It is a tutorial on how you shall set up your Twitter account. If you don't find it, you find some Twitter related videos here: Videos | Social Media Examiner (http://www.socialmediaexaminer.com/category/videos/)
As an example. WPW has a Tweet this post button if you have configured your WPW account setting to do that. But the service could have been better, since the message is not very meaningful. I use the button even if it could have been better. Here is the result of Tweeting this WPW post:
Check this out! http://www.webproworld.com/tp.php?i=501370&c=501370 (Not so sematinc or meaningful as a news heading, but followers may read it) The link is not a perma link like this:
http://www.webproworld.com/syndication-social-media-discussion-forum/100458-twitter-stealing-your-links.html#post501370 (Wait to the link redirects to the correct post and look at the URL).
That means that the link will gradually die.
Another example: http://search.twitter.com/search?q=object+overloading some minutes after I wrote the post with the heading:
Professional php 6, about object overloading and relational mapping ...
Result:
Realtime results for object overloading
kbleivik (http://twitter.com/kbleivik): Professional php 6, about object overloading and relational mapping. Download my short PDF document: http://www.oopschool.com (http://www.oopschool.com/) 11 minutes ago from web (http://twitter.com/) · Reply (http://twitter.com/?status=@kbleivik%20&in_reply_to_status_id=10265124315&in_reply_to=kbleivik) · View Tweet (http://twitter.com/kbleivik/statuses/10265124315)
I think this touches the surface of how Twitter can be used in your marketing (http://twitterpower.com/).
Source: http://twitter.com/kbleivik
I've been hanging out on twitter lately, and I have come to see it as a valuable tool, both for linking to my own blog content, and finding links to other people's blog content. Almost every single tweet that has provided valuable information for me, is a link to a blog. And, most of my retweets are someone linking to some excellent article on a blog.
I use Twitter on and off. The most important thing I've gotten from Twitter is links to excellent blogs I never would have searched for.
I've been having the same weird indexing experienced as well. I don't know if it's because I Digg my own posts or that my blog post automatically post to my Twitter account but not only will a new blog post be indexed within minutes, but it will be ranking well for it's keyphrases too.
Oh, the irony! If I add a new handout for my students to my website, it takes a while to get indexed. If I post it on Digg, my Google Alerts send it back to me within 24 hours.
mjtaylor
03-10-2010, 10:38 AM
Note:
Twitter is IMO like a live news header site.
Twitter is like an advanced news ticker with added functionality, e.g. sending an IM to your followers etc.
For that reason your short message should be meaningful, semantic.
I don't see how Twitter can supply stable semantic links.
So to the queston "Is Twitter Stealing Your Links?" I will answer No.
Note professional companies like Cnn are heavy Twitter users.
Well, maybe not *your* links, kgun, but I thought one of the main thrusts of the article was that instead of blogging about new information (which would add a long term, followed link) people are more likely to tweet it, which doesn't add a link that is useful for SERPs ...
I noted this
"Blogging has become less about sharing with your network and more about building up your own importance/business, so linking and covering the works of your peers, unless it gets you something, has limited viability. Bloggers are more professional, more self-focused and find less value in linking to/covering what others produce".
from the article. News are history second's after it is published on the internet. In finance we are using forward looking mathematical models. Adaptive backward looking models are like driving a car by looking in the mirror. Mr. Market is often ahead of the news. Two Swiss professors observed strange patterns in air companies put options prices before 09.11.2001.
News are important when they happen. Days later they are of less interest. Stable semantic links to classic articles like this adaptive path ajax: a new approach to web applications (http://www.adaptivepath.com/ideas/essays/archives/000385.php) will gradually increase that page's PageRank as more links are added.
netroact
03-10-2010, 08:39 PM
This conversation is now hovering slightly above my head. Maybe this has been covered already, but what if Google is warehousing tweets with links in their database? And, what if the tweets themselves are serving as anchor text? Do we really know what Google is doing with social networking? We can see the SE's work with realtime search, but what about long term?