Backlinks from the same website

[bobitza]

From your experience, how are links coming from the same website "valued" by SEs?

Let's say you have an IBL in the footer of a website; same footer code for all pages. Of course, some pages will have a higher power/pr/etc. than others therefore having a higher value but is there a discount applied to that "default" value when calculating the page juice transferred? Something like for 1-10 pages IBL from same site you get 80% of link juice; 10-100 IBLs you get 40% and so on.

[dozzn]

This may explain why my homepage shows up in google.... along with my "terms and conditions" page .... other pages show up every once in a while...? ... but always terms.and conditions.. which is in the footer...

[claybutler]

Your internal linking structure has an appreciable effect on your PR. I've experimented quite a bit with this and you can definitely increase the PR of deeper pages depending on how you spread your "link juice" (or should that be squirt or pour?)

The exact formula? Who knows? I'd take anyone's definitive answer on that one with a big grain of salt.

[Bernd]

@bobitza

Domainpop remains 1 !
Linkpop is not much better than a BL from the root/startpage only.

[mgk]

I think if someone had the correct answer to this one, we would all be on the top of page one for SE's. I've seen increasing amounts of people doing this, but not sure if its a big waste of time or not. Or is it a case of robbing Paul to pay Peter?

[JoomlaBear]

Internal linking can help dramatically.
Try pointing links back at your homepage using anchor text that contains your primary keywords - being the keywords you want to rank more highly for on your home page.
Links in articles are weighted more highly than footer and sidebar links.

[SEObyCanz]

Internal linking can help dramatically.
Try pointing links back at your homepage using anchor text that contains your primary keywords - being the keywords you want to rank more highly for on your home page.
Links in articles are weighted more highly than footer and sidebar links.

I agree with you JoomlaBear with a slight clarification, links from the page content in general on a page not articles in particular.

Lynny

[mjamrock]

I watched a video from Search Engine Watch from a fellow that attended a Google Conference - of course nobody knows the real Google algorithm but Google admitted that they count back links from the same URL differently than back links from multiple URLs.

The bottom line was, the more back links the better but the more URLs even better.

The video (and your post) got our attention because we own 8 sites that are all heavily crosslinked through footers. What I have seen through my own experience is that crosslinking greatly boosts our crawl rate, gets us indexed quick, and keeps the Google bot coming back.

But it seems a hundred backlinks from one site is not as valuable for PR as a hundred backlinks from a hundred sites.

I will try to find you the video and provide a link so you can watch it too and make up your own mind.

Britt

[mgk]

I agree with you JoomlaBear with a slight clarification, links from the page content in general on a page not articles in particular.

Lynny


So, putting links with your keywords as anchor text on your own link pages, can actually help with SE positioning? Sounds a bit wild.:)

[morestar]

The question is though, does anyone have a really decent resource (link) to a great tutorial or explanation of how to perform internal linking? This I need to know. Many of the page I don't need to show up in the search results do when there are definitely others that should instead.

[blogdawg1]

First, I don't think bobitza was asking about internal links. If so, I say avoid them and link from your content.

If you are talking about external backlinks, then footer links are not the best. mjamrock is right, links from different domains are far better than a lot of links from a single domain.

[confettiguru]

Let me see if I understand. Do a search for a particular keyword, if you have good SERP, link from that page to pages that do not have good SERP. Is this correct?

[morestar]

A good internal linking strategy would be to find your most important pages.

Then look for less important, high ranking pages.

Use the less important pages to link to your more important pages.

This will share the link juice from the unimportant pages to the important ones.

I always try to interlink all the pages together, as it help guide the spiders through your website. If your sitemap is outdated, but you have a well structured internal linking system then the search engines will be able to index your new pages without a sitemap update.

Hope that helps.


so my question would be: what percentage of success to you have using the above strategy?

[angilina]

From your experience, how are links coming from the same website "valued" by SEs?

Let's say you have an IBL in the footer of a website; same footer code for all pages. Of course, some pages will have a higher power/pr/etc. than others therefore having a higher value but is there a discount applied to that "default" value when calculating the page juice transferred? Something like for 1-10 pages IBL from same site you get 80% of link juice; 10-100 IBLs you get 40% and so on.

I am not sure but I think I saw Matt Cutts saying one of his videos that, links from the same site do count as normal links as long as the links are coming from quality pages. Quality of every page is different, so backlink quality will depend on quality of the page.

How many backlinks are too many? I think, only Google know how many links will be too many from the same site to give the same credit.

[InfoHQ.us]

Some of the highly competitive keywords are "digital products", "cheap ebooks", "cheap plr ebooks", & "cheap computer program".

Despite not getting any thematic incoming back links, one of my websites is on the page 1 of G because of its internal linking structure done the correct ways.

[SemAdvance]

A few things to remember

1. People posting here that self linking works are probably targeting non competitive keyword terms.

2. Google will value new links initially to boost rankings but over time will devalue those links as useless. Competitive nature of the keywords involved may or may not make this statement pertinent to your own goals.

3. Voting for yourself will never see you win a popularity contest. Much better to have 100s of other people vote for you. (vote = link to).

4. Where links are on a page, probably has little influence on the value of said link, given search spiders crawl pages and index content, and do not index coding found on the pages.

5. Build websites that users enjoy / find informative / answers their needs, and you will never need to worry if a silly internal link scheme works.

Hope this helps!!

[mnboater]

Even if there isn't an appreciable value from SEs, I use these links to drive traffic to my other sites. I market my other sites in different markets. My art site hits different demographics and different audiences. For me, there is potential in the impulse purchase from a user that my demographic research isn't turning up.

[smeatz]

One method I use (with a considerable degree of success so far *touch wood*)... is to do the following:

1) ALWAYS link my most unimportant pages to my most IMPORTANT pages. Typically, that means linking second and third level pages to the "money pages" i.e. the ones that bring in the bacon (usually linking to the Home page and a couple of other 'consistently visited' pages will do the trick).

2) NEVER link my most important pages to my LEAST important pages.

3) Place the "nofollow" command in any link from a high-ranking internal "money" page to "lower-ranking but still important" page. NB: Preserve your Google Juice whatever way you can! Why? Because you WILL gain position in the SERPS for your "higher ranked money pages" as long as you don't give any of the Google Juice away.

4) "nofollow" your nav links and footer links too (as they're simply not as effective or important to Google than 'real-life, in-your-face, anchor text' in the body of your internal page content.

As for having "Privacy" pages appear in page 1 of Google? Well, they're never going to convert customers ... but if they have "visible page rank" you could always do what I do...and that is to 'add a line or two of relevant and well-written copy at the foot of your "Privacy" page (also works for Terms Of Service pages too) and then slot in a keyword-rich anchor text link to your "money page" (eg. Home Page). At least, that way you'll be leveraging off the Pagerank on a totally non-productive page and pouring it onto a page that you WANT to rank for!

NB: The premise behind everything I have suggested above assumes that you have a site with "a considerable amount of pages" as opposed to half-a-dozen :)

Cheers,

Smeatz

[ericajoieake]

based on what i have experienced backlinks that came from a forum like this for example on the same thread using your signature with several post, it is counted as one backlink for your site.

[mjamrock]

Whoaa!
This is getting NUTS!
Links are great as far as Google is concerned. ANY links. Back links are counted if they come from the same domain differently- than if from different domains. MORE domains the better but still same domains do count.

I tried to read the responses you got and I apologize? PEOPLE? These critters are clueless and weird!

Switch over to SEO Search Engine Watch- the professionals.

I am disgraced and will not participate in this forum again for the bizarre advice you are getting. I sincerely apologize- because i understand you, like me are serious.

Switch over to the professionals- Search Engine Watch.

Bizarre responses you are getting.

I have gotten nut job bizarre responses my self!
Sorry,
Britt

[kevE]

I agree with blogdawg1, bobitza specifically mentions IBLs not internal links. If I understand correctly this is something I experimented with. We had a reciprocal arrangement with a site in the same industry but different geographic location. We placed links to each other’s site in the footer of every page including dynamic pages. After several months I saw no benefit in ranking, SERPs or traffic and in fact during that time SERPs dropped off, probably not because of this but I decided not to continue with this strategy.

[mjamrock]

What kind of advice are you giving out?
First OFF no one knows the GOOGLE algorithm?

Secondly? All we can do is give our own experience?

Please READ the question initially posted before you give your two and a half cents?

I am as clueless as all of us as to whether PR or back links matters? But I will not mislead somebody!

I have gained a ton from this forum- please don't let me down by giving out false "I know best" advice! And scaring me off to leave?

Sad truth is, outside of the golden rule of "POST unique and valuable content": (Go figure) none of us know a way to trick a search engine on THAT one!

I have outranked a PR 7 with great content on a loust PR 0! And as for my business - we are a lowley DJ company- I have watched hundreds of other DJ companies with higher PR smash us!

But I love my visitors from South Africa that want to view Billboards hottest hits this week?

LOL. MY JOB is to turn that TRAFFIC into $!

Are we on the same page?
I like making pretty, interactive websites too- but it is all about the TRAFFIC and the ROI!

It is a cute game to start up a new website- and back link like crazy from a footer- but please do not mislead someone that is the answer!

Whether we like it or not- we MUST provide:

UNIQUE, Valuable CONTENT.
IE- WE must have something new to offer, something new to be added to the index. Otherwise we are just one voice of thousands (if not millions).

No matter how many external or internal back links we have?

The internet and SERPS are just like the REAL world!

Britt

[LocalGoogleGuru]

This may explain why my homepage shows up in google.... along with my "terms and conditions" page .... other pages show up every once in a while...? ... but always terms.and conditions.. which is in the footer...

From what I've been told Google accepts a maximum of 2 inbound links from a single domain... by this reasoning if you have dozens of inbound links from a domain only 2 are going to be visible in serps.

My experience bears that out as well.

[LocalGoogleGuru]

I watched a video from Search Engine Watch from a fellow that attended a Google Conference - of course nobody knows the real Google algorithm but Google admitted that they count back links from the same URL differently than back links from multiple URLs.

The bottom line was, the more back links the better but the more URLs even better.

The video (and your post) got our attention because we own 8 sites that are all heavily crosslinked through footers. What I have seen through my own experience is that crosslinking greatly boosts our crawl rate, gets us indexed quick, and keeps the Google bot coming back.

But it seems a hundred backlinks from one site is not as valuable for PR as a hundred backlinks from a hundred sites.

I will try to find you the video and provide a link so you can watch it too and make up your own mind.

Britt


I'd like to see that video if you can find it

thanks

[mjamrock]

With all due respect Turtle Guru (our icon is two lizards btw) that is complete NONSENSE. Google accepts TWO? Two what?

Where do you people get your information?

ALL you have to do is go to FireFox- get the X-ray SEO tools? Suddenly! Wow!
Every site you visit has a page rank! Every site you visit you can view their internal and external back links?

Wow?

Two what? Where do you guys get your info? I am sorry if I sound round but please?

Want to score high in SERPs?

OK- here is the BIG secret.

REAdy?

You need to have something UNIQUE to say?

PR be damned? PR is for carbon copy cut outs of identical products! That are worried- 15 people have the same content? WILL I appear at the top of the results?

Please!

Oh and yes! Back links count FROM THE SAME DOMAIN COUNT! If you are not serious about your business- you won't have three hundred pages with footers to back link to your other home page!

Make sense?

Provide unique content, be consistent, don't blast the index with plagiarized and redundant BS- be yourself- publish as many pages as you can! Get to the top!

Be dumb, steal others content and try to publish it on your site, don't be unique?And whine, whine, whine?

Good grief Charlie Brown!
What exactly- no stop and think about it? Do you want from Google?

LOL,
Britt

[LocalGoogleGuru]

With all due respect Turtle Guru (our icon is two lizards btw) that is complete NONSENSE. Google accepts TWO? Two what?

Where do you people get your information?

ALL you have to do is go to FireFox- get the X-ray SEO tools? Suddenly! Wow!
Every site you visit has a page rank! Every site you visit you can view their internal and external back links?

Wow?

Two what? Where do you guys get your info? I am sorry if I sound round but please?

Want to score high in SERPs?

OK- here is the BIG secret.

REAdy?

You need to have something UNIQUE to say?

PR be damned? PR is for carbon copy cut outs of identical products! That are worried- 15 people have the same content? WILL I appear at the top of the results?

Please!

Oh and yes! Back links count FROM THE SAME DOMAIN COUNT! If you are not serious about your business- you won't have three hundred pages with footers to back link to your other home page!

Make sense?

Provide unique content, be consistent, don't blast the index with plagiarized and redundant BS- be yourself- publish as many pages as you can! Get to the top!

Be dumb, steal others content and try to publish it on your site, don't be unique?And whine, whine, whine?

Good grief Charlie Brown!
What exactly- no stop and think about it? Do you want from Google?

LOL,
Britt

Ok, I said it wrong (and my icon is the hulk, not a turtle)

the SERPS show two from each domain, the original poster asked about backlinks counting and I responded with SERPS... my bad, I mixed the two up.

Since there is backlinks that count and backlinks that are in the supplemental index that allegedly count less and we have no way to ascertain which counts more (because that's Google's secret sauce and they're not revealing it)

I consider a backlink that counts as one that shows up in the serps.

... In doing so I ignored that there are backlinks that increase page rank

my bad.

There is fantasy page rank (the little green bar in the Google tool bar)
and secret page rank (PR that makes a site increase in rank)

and there is the follow / no follow debate...

for my money. if a back link shows up the the serps it did me some good
if it's in the supplemental and not showing up in the serps I don't worry about it.

if it DOES show up in the serps no matter if it's good or crappy (shades of lessor quality) at least it's area denial ... the more I take up the less there is for my competitors.

[mjamrock]

IF YOU ARE NOT THE TEENAGE MUTANT NINJA TURTLE IGNORE THIS MESSAGE!

WAIT A MINUTE?
You said, you said, and I quote? "Supplemental index".....? YOU said that? Do you, like any teen age mutant teen age mutant ninja turtle I know....."Pizza"? My favorite food?

Sorry to digress. I acused others of abusing the forum and not reading the initial question. Now I am abusing it for my own questions!

You did say "supplemental index"? and indirectly "pizza"?

LOL.

98% of my pages are in supplemental- yes the supplemental index! WOW! You know about that? yet Woopra still tracks them? Do you know what I mean by Woopra?

If you do know? Are you on the beta test list for Woopra? If not- well..... hmmm. I am but aside from stalking my visitors- 2 days worth of data? What good is Woopra? LOL.

I'd give you my IP but something tells me you already have it?

My sincerist apoligies- I had NO idea I was talking to a "supplemental" kind of guy?

Britt

[NJ]

A few things to remember


5. Build websites that users enjoy / find informative / answers their needs, and you will never need to worry if a silly internal link scheme works.

Hope this helps!!

Right, and make your links helpful to the people who have to use them!

[smeatz]

I have outranked a PR 7 with great content on a loust PR 0! And as for my business - we are a lowley DJ company- I have watched hundreds of other DJ companies with higher PR smash us!

But I love my visitors from South Africa that want to view Billboards hottest hits this week?

LOL. MY JOB is to turn that TRAFFIC into $!

Are we on the same page?
I like making pretty, interactive websites too- but it is all about the TRAFFIC and the ROI!

Britt

This may seem slightly off-topic but hopefully everyone reading it will learn something here:

I've been having a good 'ole thorough "nosey" at your website and I am left wondering why you are so harsh on some of the folks in here when your own website leaves a bit to be desired from an SEO point of view.

1) Jamrock Entertainment (http://www.jamrockentertainment.com) has NO meta description, NO keywords and a Page Title that contains precisely ZERO PERCENT "wow factor" and no reason for anyone to "click through" i.e. Title Tag = "Jamrock Entertainment"

2)jamrockentertainment.com/south-florida-djs/doral-djs.html has a 'totally keyword-spammed Title Tag' i.e. "Doral dj, Doral djs, Doral d.j., Doral disc jockeys, djs Doral"

Now (trying not to sound like a complete moron) I do realize that you rank #1 for Doral disc jockeys and other variations of this phrase. However, no matter which version of this keyword you enter into the Google Keyword selector Tool (or Keyword Discovery or Word Tracker)... there simply "isn't enough data to suggest people are searching for those terms.

Soooooooooo... how exactly DO you get your traffic???

It's meaningless to rank #1, #2 or #3 in Google when no-one except your "converted customers" actually know who you are - or "where you are".

Check out the sad lack of Google AdWords ads on the right-hand side of the web pages in Google that you rank #1 in... there's either NONE or ONE at the most! That should tell you something --- "there's no profit in trying to rank for those terms."

Why not do some proper keyword research... then use PPC to actually "TEST" the commercial intent of your chosen keywords...and then ONLY OPTIMIZE for the keywords that PASS THE TEST!

Adding "fresh new content" is all well and good... but how about taking your traffic-generation strategies to the next level so that "a ton more prospects can actually get to see and enjoy your fresh new content".

Cheers,

Smeatz

[aattwood]

I think keep it real and you get the benefit. Both traffic and pagerank

[aattwood]

to me it does not make sense to try and scam the system and that can be seen as a lesson for life

[astro]

to me it does not make sense to try and scam the system and that can be seen as a lesson for life

Bravo!

Time would be better spent reading some of the "older" heads within this forum's archives, than kicking off over avatars. This has been covered many times in the past. There are some great guys on this forum who offer valuable advice and help. Check them out. You could not buy that combined knowledge in a package anywhere for any amount! It is offered to you free!

BTW, Page Rank means nothing. You can have a PR of 1 or 2 yet rank No1 for your keywords and search terms. Any SEO "expert" who uses PR to justify and sell services to me or explain what they do and why they do it (not that they ever do) would be shown the door.....if I had one

So please read the archives. (Polite enough???.....I do wish to be!)

smiles
/astro

[ChiefLee]

Hey mjamrock (http://www.webproworld.com/members/106474.html). GREAT POSTS! This is one of the worst threads EVER. Did nobody take the time to read the original question? And even the answers they're providing (to the wrong question) are absurdly wrong.

1 - Multiple links from the same domain DO count. I see them all the time in Google's Webmaster Tools.

2 - Every SE is different, but think of it this way. One link is great. Each additional link provides less and less added value to you. And pretty quickly. For instance if the first link is worth a $1 in pagerank juice, the second link is probably worth no more than $.50. And it drops pretty quickly from there. Site wide links provide little (but some) more value than just a link from a home page.

3 - Don't shy away from getting multiple links on a site, but certainly don't focus on it. Diversity of domains in MUCH more important. mjamrock (http://www.webproworld.com/members/106474.html) is absolutely correct that 100 links from 100 sites is MUCH better than 100 links on 1 site.

INTERNAL LINKING -- And for all of you guys posting about internal links, first, you need to read Matt Cutts post about pagerank sculpting and the use of no follows. You can NO LONGER alter the flow (amount sent per link) of pagerank using no follows. Google changed this in their algorithm last year.

SEOMOZ has a great article you all should read about the best practices of preparing your site for good SERPs. And stop posting here with ridiculous comments when you don't know what you're talking about, and don't bother reading the original question.

[cbosleeds]

Just want to chip in with a couple of points.

As SEObyCanz (http://www.webproworld.com/members/94351.html) mentioned way up the page, good internal linking can be very important. yahoo for instance really seems to like it when you use full URLs.

As for the question of whether links from the same site work - in my experience they do. last year a customer came to us for some consultancy and they already had 8000 IBLs from the same site and were 5th for their major search term which was mid to high range competitive. All they needed from us was some onpage work and a bit of guidance. however, its obviously much safer not to put all your eggs in one basket since, if you rely too heavily on links from one place, then you run the risk of losing them all in one go.

[morestar]

With all due respect Turtle Guru (our icon is two lizards btw) that is complete NONSENSE. Google accepts TWO? Two what?

Where do you people get your information?

ALL you have to do is go to FireFox- get the X-ray SEO tools? Suddenly! Wow!
Every site you visit has a page rank! Every site you visit you can view their internal and external back links?

Wow?

Two what? Where do you guys get your info? I am sorry if I sound round but please?

Want to score high in SERPs?

OK- here is the BIG secret.

REAdy?

You need to have something UNIQUE to say?

PR be damned? PR is for carbon copy cut outs of identical products! That are worried- 15 people have the same content? WILL I appear at the top of the results?

Please!

Oh and yes! Back links count FROM THE SAME DOMAIN COUNT! If you are not serious about your business- you won't have three hundred pages with footers to back link to your other home page!

Make sense?

Provide unique content, be consistent, don't blast the index with plagiarized and redundant BS- be yourself- publish as many pages as you can! Get to the top!

Be dumb, steal others content and try to publish it on your site, don't be unique?And whine, whine, whine?

Good grief Charlie Brown!
What exactly- no stop and think about it? Do you want from Google?

LOL,
Britt

i think Britts on to something here...

[GameFriends]

Whoaa!
Switch over to SEO Search Engine Watch- the professionals.
Britt

Your an idiot and your Engrish is shit, while you attack others for their incompetence....You have the most generic female picture as your avatar. We all know you are a bob and not a "Britt". Back to the issue at hand.

You can have thousands of links from one domain pointing to your website. While they are valuable, they are not as valuable as the same amount of links spread over multiple domains. If you can get these links, then get them, otherwise get links from domains you already don't have links to.

Interlinking - for ONpage links you will want to link to your own pages with the appropriate anchor text such as Red Widgets versus Widgets or just Click here. You can help yourself somewhat with interlinking so mine as well take advantage of it.

[henrybarnett]

First example: Google the word "cle" or "clé". That means "key" in French and is a pretty generic term (with or without the accent on the e.) Now look for the website cleservice.com which usually is in the first few search returns, and look at the bottom of their page. Follow a few links.

Best example: now Google the word "montre" That means "watch" in French and is also a pretty generic term. Now look for the website tictactime.com which is normally 1st and look at the bottom of their page. Follow a few links.

There are about 150 links to 150 pages each link has the word "montre" twice in each link on the bottom part. Each linked page has the same links at the bottom. 300 x 300 = 90000. There are a further 120 links on the left side each with the word montre in the link twice. No wonder they are number one with "MONTRE"!!

So that's the proof how good backlinks work.

[bobitza]

First, I don't think bobitza was asking about internal links. If so, I say avoid them and link from your content.


Did nobody take the time to read the original question? And even the answers they're providing (to the wrong question) are absurdly wrong.


It seems that not everyone bothers to read the question or read AND understand the question ... hehe :)


I watched a video from Search Engine Watch from a fellow that attended a Google Conference - of course nobody knows the real Google algorithm but Google admitted that they count back links from the same URL differently than back links from multiple URLs.

That was the type of response I was looking for. Care to share the link?

[itispals]

Hi,
I think the following link from MattCutts should give you the answer:
PageRank sculpting (http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/pagerank-sculpting/)

Hope this helps.
Thanks,
buckleupnow.com (http://www.buckleupnow.com)

[JoomlaBear]

SEM Advance I have to disagree.

Internal linking works, It really does.

I would agree with you though that given the choice of an inbound link from another website vs internal linking you should take the link from the other site every time.

However there is no reason not to improve your SEO even more with a good internal linking strategy.

I would never refer to internal linking as 'silly' because it does have a very real affect on your rankings.

A lot of people do not realize that Google will in many cases rank if relevancy score is very high, not just inbound links. You can improve your relevancy score by linking internally with the right anchor text.

Give it a try.



- and your internal
A few things to remember

1. People posting here that self linking works are probably targeting non competitive keyword terms.

2. Google will value new links initially to boost rankings but over time will devalue those links as useless. Competitive nature of the keywords involved may or may not make this statement pertinent to your own goals.

3. Voting for yourself will never see you win a popularity contest. Much better to have 100s of other people vote for you. (vote = link to).

4. Where links are on a page, probably has little influence on the value of said link, given search spiders crawl pages and index content, and do not index coding found on the pages.

5. Build websites that users enjoy / find informative / answers their needs, and you will never need to worry if a silly internal link scheme works.

Hope this helps!!

[background_check]

From the very beginning, google depends on number of links going back in your page. but yahoo depends on the number of search. But these style is always changing. We don't have control in search engines. Keep perform in websites to look natural.

[loosapphire]

From your experience, how are links coming from the same website "valued" by SEs?

Let's say you have an IBL in the footer of a website; same footer code for all pages. Of course, some pages will have a higher power/pr/etc. than others therefore having a higher value but is there a discount applied to that "default" value when calculating the page juice transferred? Something like for 1-10 pages IBL from same site you get 80% of link juice; 10-100 IBLs you get 40% and so on.

When it comes to more specific way to conduct, does back links from directory submitting weight higher than those from signature from one forum? The reason is that they come from different urls?

[aattwood]

if it makes sence to link from the footer then do that. If its spammy avoid the link.