MSN: do we really care?

[omeomi]

I wake up. I make myself a coffee, sometimes I have cereal, sometimes I have a bacon roll. Then I have a shower, shave, and head off to work. It takes me about half an hour to drive in to work, and I have to park away from the office as I don't have a designated space. It then takes me about ten minutes to walk to work. When I get to work I turn my computer on, fire up the monitors, and make another coffee. The first thing I do is check my e-mail, the second is checking my ranking in Google.

Does anyone think that MSN search is more relevant to SEO than that paragraph? Because I don't.

[AndrewX]

MSN is lately a friend to the SEO of new websites.

I've found MSN to be the first engine to send visitors to some sites, and even once Google and Yahoo catch-up, MSN can still send more visitors if the site happens to also be ranked well.

Also I've never seen SEOs so excited about a new engine...

Where do I want to go today?

The bank. ;)

[PizdusInc]

The most important thing about MSN is that it is integrated into the Windows OS and many people just use it by default because they don't know any better. Next thing is that Microsoft has loads and loads of money, and looking at their history they have crushed almost everyone who "challenged" them. They will do everything in their power to become and stay #1. So, I would say better start tuning your MSN SEO'ing skills now...

[omeomi]

I am not even in the first hundred for the pages/keywords I'm concerned with in MSN, but I am for Google, I find it hard to justify spending the time on it when the same time on google can bring so much more traffic.

MSN seems to allow more spammy technniques. We'll see, I know a lot of SEO's are really excited by the new engine, maybe I just haven't seen the benefits yet.

In the future there will be robots.

[montytx]

For those of us in the sandbox MSN in about half of my traffic. They are by far the fastest and most up to date engine. I would say if your ignoring them you are going to miss a shift in the market. I think MSN search will double their market share this year from the wobbling Google. Just my 2 cents.

[chiron]

MSN I agree seems to index quite often, and has no obvious penalties for new sites and even for most white-and-gray area SEO from what I can tell.

I've been as a result quite pleased with them, but it's only a matter of time before, with such an open-door policy, MSN is flooded with spam and crap and old sites much as Google so often seems to be these days. I figure, whether they gain market share or not (they will, is my guess), there will come a point where they are forced to install some delays or penalties of some kind, or they'll end up being as irrelevant as I find Google to be on certain searches at times. Note to Google, good lord people, tried to find an image, and like, 80% are bad links - spider that from time to time, eh? And yeah I know images come and go, but used to be better than that... cache the suckers and all is well...

[nickberry]

MSN seems to allow more spammy technniques I've seen so many of keywords hijacked by irrelavant sites on google lately it's hardly worth my time optimizing for them. Although the more I spend optimizing our MSN, the better my SERPS are becoming for google as well.

[toddieg]

MSN Search is here to stay... Microsoft has so much money and everytime I turn on the TV or visit a website I see some kind of advertisment promoting the new MSN search. They are even advertising via Google Adwords (which is funny how google allows that just to make a buck)

My opinion: Despite the dispute on the 'quality' of results, MSN Search will become more and more popular do to Microsoft's persitence and aggressive advertising techniques. They will soon capitalize on Google's marketshare and will keep tweaking their algorithm to provide higher quality results. In addition, Google will continue to upset webmasters by implementing crazy algorithms and having inconsistent SERPs. MSN will be the engine of the future.

[tomzo]

I am getting more traffic from MSN now than I've ever received from google, and I think more and more people are moving to search with MSN.

Google seems to have forgotten that webmasters use search engines too, and googles behaviour towards new websites lately, has driven many people towards MSN.

MSN is on the up!

[Jade456]

I can't say that MSN has made a big difference. I have the exact ranking on Google and MSN for Las Vegas Real Estate. Looking at my logs, Google sends at least 5 times the traffic to me on that term. I like that fact that MSN seems to update its serps quicker, but for me at least, they just don't send the visitors.

[janeth]

We rank in the top 10 for both website design and search engine optimization. We get a good bit of traffic from them and it seems to grow everyday.

What I have seen is that we get more sales from MSN then Google.

I wonder how many of the people doing the searches in Google are just web masters checking there ranking?

[freehits]

I wonder how many of the people doing the searches in Google are just web masters checking there ranking?

Hmmm smart thought. I would imagine it is a few percentage points from just automated searches and scraping scripts on "scrape and spam sites".

[wavedancing]

I am not even in the first hundred for the pages/keywords I'm concerned with in MSN, but I am for Google, I find it hard to justify spending the time on it when the same time on google can bring so much more traffic.

MSN seems to allow more spammy technniques. We'll see, I know a lot of SEO's are really excited by the new engine, maybe I just haven't seen the benefits yet.

In the future there will be robots.

I now get more traffic from msn than any other engines. Should I care msn? Sure.

[adbart]

the wobbling Google
Never heard anyone refer to them like that before! I wouldn't agree with you anyhow. MSN is important but not the market leader, yet.

[janeth]

How do you know there not the market leader.

Google is using there browser to make fake clicks.

So what we see may not be what we get.

[who67]

MSN in my opinion is growing in the ranks and actually producing more and more traffic to my site as we speak. In fact MSN is now my number 2 traffic generator behind Google and ahead of Yahoo.

So do I care about MSN? YOU BET!

MSN can no longer be ignored. If you do it could mean valuable traffic to your site and hurt your bottom line.

[adbart]

How do you know there not the market leader.

Google is using there browser to make fake clicks
What do you mean??!


MSN is now my number 2 traffic generator behind Google
This is the same scenario for most people. Janeth, they are not the market leader - millions upon millions more people search with Google every day than MSN.

I'm not saying it might not happen, but MSN Search is not anywhere near as popular as Google yet.

[janeth]

We rank in the top for all three for our keywords but we get more customers from MSN.

Here is what I think,

First we can not trust our stats Do not trust your stats (http://www.geeksonsteroids.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1514)

But second I think most people searching on Google are web masters checking there ranking.

Google does not market their site while MSN does.

How do we know that half the searches on Google are nothing more then web masters?

[webmasterjunkie]

We rank in the top for all three for our keywords but we get more customers from MSN.

Here is what I think,

First we can not trust our stats Do not trust your stats (http://www.geeksonsteroids.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1514)

But second I think most people searching on Google are web masters checking there ranking.

Google does not market their site while MSN does.

How do we know that half the searches on Google are nothing more then web masters?

I absolutely love that post. I have often sat there Googling myself, wondering, how many other webmaster'junkies' are doing the same? If Google is counting clicks on SERP's as 'votes' how many times have we voted for our competitors and such.

I strongly believe that a good portion of the searches on Google are from webmasters.

[adbart]

I strongly believe that a lot of searches are performed by webmasters.

I do not believe that this is a good proportion, however.

Do you have any idea just how many people are searching using Google at any one time?

A fraction of those searches are performed by webmasters.

The vast majority are the customers you are trying to target.

[janeth]

I´m talking about removing the web masters from both list and then comparing the two.

Are you sure Google would be ahead then?

[adbart]

Certainly.

I don't think many people will dispute this - Google have a vast majority in terms of user numbers.

[janeth]

I´m not sure where they are now but here is the last one I saw.


Google, and the software giant is hungry for more.

Google fields 35.1 percent of the searches online, followed by Yahoo at 31.8 percent and MSN at 16 percent, according to ComScore QSearch.

If MSN pulls a little of the market from Google which I´m sure they have it will let Yahoo take the lead.

I do not see the gap being all that wide.

[crankydave]

I'm not prepared to ignore any SE traffic. No matter how large or how small it all deserves my attention. The question does naturally become how much attention.

So to answer you directly, yes, I really care about my MSN rankings and monitor them as well as the others. A high ranking on all SE's can be nothing but a good thing.


I wonder how many of the people doing the searches in Google are just web masters checking there ranking?

Very interesting point Janeth. I also wonder how many webmasters and/or site owners skew the keyword suggestion tools as well.

Dave

[adbart]

If MSN pulls a little of the market from Google which I´m sure they have it will let Yahoo take the lead.

I do not see the gap being all that wide.
On what basis? Every shred of evidence suggests that a huge majority of referrals are from Google.

It is more likely that MSN will become the primary search engine than Yahoo taking the lead due to Google/MSN pulling users away from each other.

Yahoo having been losing out consistently for several years now, and it certainly doesn't look like they're on the road for a comeback.

[brian.mark]

I recently saw in an email newsletter that the #1 search term (could be as low as #10 on a given day, but it is overall #1) on MSN and Yahoo is google.com. That suggests that people have MSN or Yahoo as their startup pages and just don't want to do something scary like use the address bar. As long as it is typed into Yahoo, it is safe, right?

In any case, we'll never get a true "Valid Searches per Day" from any engine, and if they were all required to give us that figure, they'd all count it differently anyway, making it useless once again.

Brian.

[adbart]

Of course.

Do you know anything about these 'fake clicks' that apparently the Google Toolbar makes?

I read in another thread that they might be spoofing the toolbar as an automated browser, effectively...

[janeth]

If MSN pulls a little of the market from Google which I´m sure they have it will let Yahoo take the lead.

I do not see the gap being all that wide.
On what basis? Every shred of evidence suggests that a huge majority of referrals are from Google.

It is more likely that MSN will become the primary search engine than Yahoo taking the lead due to Google/MSN pulling users away from each other.

Yahoo having been losing out consistently for several years now, and it certainly doesn't look like they're on the road for a comeback.


Here is the evidence

Google fields 35.1 percent of the searches online, followed by Yahoo at 31.8 percent

[janeth]

Of course.

Do you know anything about these 'fake clicks' that apparently the Google Toolbar makes?

I read in another thread that they might be spoofing the toolbar as an automated browser, effectively...

This is from Google

Now Google's faster than ever on Firefox and Mozilla browsers. When you do a search on these browsers, we instruct them to download your top search result in advance, so if you click on it, you'll get to that page even more quickly.

[adbart]

Here is the evidence

Google fields 35.1 percent of the searches online, followed by Yahoo at 31.8 percent
I don't believe your stats.

[Jade456]

Yahoo having been losing out consistently for several years now, and it certainly doesn't look like they're on the road for a comeback.

There is the real loser. Yahoo has been blowing it for a while, and I think that MSN is going to take a huge chunk of their searches, and a smaller portion from google. I think G will stay #1, but MSN will be a very strong #2.

[janeth]

Here is the evidence

Google fields 35.1 percent of the searches online, followed by Yahoo at 31.8 percent
I don't believe your stats.

If you do not trust the stats there is nothing I can do about that. lol

[janeth]

Here´s you a link

Google fields 35.1 percent of the searches online, followed by Yahoo at 31.8 percent (http://www.google.com/search?q=Google+fields+35.1+percent+of+the+searche s+online,+followed+by+Yahoo+at+31.8+percent&hl=en&lr=&safe=off&filter=0)

[adbart]

I think G will stay #1, but MSN will be a very strong #2.
I agree completely.

Janeth, I apologise for not trusting you, but I still find those statistics hard to believe.

[janeth]

Not trusting me is not a problem, Those are the only stats I have found.

[brian.mark]

Those are global numbers. Stateside, the numbers tend to favor Google more, while Asian countries have tended to favor Yahoo.

Seems like the difference between countries grows every time I attend SES, and it still amazes me that nobody has required these public companies to share the information of how many searches are done from each country, or even how many searches are done for a particular phrase. What happened to public companies having to share information with shareholders?

Brian.