wysiwyg app with the cleanest code

[toby_bird]

Currently, I create pages one of two ways. Either I write the code out myself or I use an app like Frontpage and then clean up the code. I'm tired of the excess code Frontpage generates and am thinking of buying both In Design and Macromedia Studio MX.

If you were to use a wysiwyg application for web page design, which would you choose? Dreamweaver, In Design, Frontpage, others?

As well, what do use today and what's on your wishlist?

Thanks!

[Webnauts]

If you want to work with WYSIWYG, and you can afford buying, then use Dreamweaver.

If you want a free WYSIWYG editor, use NVU found here: http://www.nvu.com/index.html

If you want to make hardcoding, then I suggest HTML Kit found here: http://www.chami.com

I personally am a hard coder, and I use HTML Kit. And besides there are a lot of useful plugins for it.

[MarcieZoob]

FYI - InDesign is not for web sites, it's for creating documents for press. (If you're going to be creating catalogs and newsletters that will go to press, InDesign is wonderful!)

Dreamweaver is the best for writing compliant code in a WYSIWYG editor.

[toby_bird]

Webnauts, thanks for reply, I'll defiantly check out the HTML Kit.

MarcieZoob,you are absolutely right! I was looking at my In Design box when I posted. What I should have said was Adobe Go Live.

I know the Studio MX is a bit of overkill, but I used to work with Flash when it was version 3 and loved it...plus, I'm just itching to work with Cold Fusion. (of, course I'll end up buying it and Macromedia will release "Blackstone" the next day. lol) Anyway, I've been told that DreamWeaver offers a good bit of CSS integration, building, etc. Is this true? And has anyone used Go Live?

[MarcieZoob]

You might want to search the forum since there's been a great of discussion in the past - GoLive vs. Dreamweaver.

Personal preference prevails. I have both but always use Dreamweaver.

[paulhiles]

And has anyone used Go Live?
Hi toby_bird, I think speed (http://www.webproworld.com/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=9403), (a member here) uses Go Live as part of his setup, you might want to drop him a PM?

Paul

[speed]

Hi toby_bird, Paul is correct I use GoLive CS exclusively, I've tried Dreamwaever but never got on with it.

I don't really use the WYSIWYG mode of GoLive as it doesn't give me the control I want or need when producing pure CSS layouts. Having said that you should not think bad of GoLive as in my opinion it is no different to Dreamweaver in that respect.

I tend to use GoLive to manage the project, I do the layout in the source view and I build the CSS using a combination of the CSS source view (which has completion) and the CSS editor GUI.

To some extent I do enter text content in the WYSIWYG mode, but I find for the more complex CSS layouts that GoLive is unable to render the page properly in the WYSIWYG mode and I'm then forced to resort to source view.

If you are content with table based layouts and using CSS to style parts of the content then GoLive is quite capable and the code is as clean as any I’ve seen from a WYSIWYG editor.

GoLive integrates nicely with Photoshop and other Adobe tools, for example you can drop a Photoshop file into the page and it will generate the web version then as you update the original Photoshop file GoLive will auto regenerate the web version. Again I don't tend to use this as I find it's easier to image slice in Photoshop and save the slices etc.

Reading this back I'm wondering why I'm using it and not notepad, the only thing I can say is the CSS editor and the source mode completion of commands make life much simpler.

My advice is to download the demo of Dreamweaver and GoLive then see which you get on with, they are both capable packages, as you have InDesign you might find GoLive more familiar.

GoLive Demo (http://www.adobe.com/products/tryadobe/main.jsp#product=26)
Dreamweaver Demo (http://www.macromedia.com/downloads/)

I think with either package you should not rely 100% on the WYSIWIG mode but be prepared to roll your sleeves up and attack the source as I think at present you can always do a better job than the tools.

Hope that's some help.

Paul

[toby_bird]

speed thanks for the reply. It helps a great deal. I've looked at both of the demos and have found similarities, strengths and weaknesses with both products. What I was looking for (and found) in the replys were the real world experiences.


Reading this back I'm wondering why I'm using it and not notepad

lol thank goodness I'm not the only one left! Even though there are a number of tools out there for coders, I can't seem to break away from simple apps like Notepad and Textpad.

[greeneagle]

toby_bird

IMO - DreamWeaver is the best but I believe you will find that to W3C validate some handcoding will be required yet.

Just to clear things up, I want to say that "Clean" code can exist with or without tables or in combination with CSS. But I bet you knew that already!

Good luck there.

Ken

[linknode]

Toby,

I am going to give you a one sided opinion because I have been a long time user of Macromedia products.

Dreamweaver MX's code and CSS integration are second to none, not to mention integration with other technologies like ColdFusion, PHP, ASP, Javascript, VBscript, .NET C#, .NET VB, JSP, and MySQL to name a few.

in addition, it plays very nice with the entire MX Family making work much easier and enjoyable.

Sure MX costs more, but it's true that you get what you pay for, here is my unofficial slogan for MX:

"Studio MX, more money, less headache"

Good luck to you :)

[Mac 5]

GoLive is the Adobe web layout program you may be thinking of. If you buy the Adobe CS package is has Photoshop, Illustrator, GoLive, InDesign and Acrobat. If you're a student you can get a pretty good discount also.