1st post and need guidance on tools

bbodenstein · #1 (**permalink**) 12-05-2003, 01:07 PM

I am a small business owner who inherited what I think is an awful website (that does generate some traffic) and it's now time to redo completely from scratch. The current site is hosted out in CA (I'm in NC) and I don't have a real good relationship with the original developer. I have been able to tweek some of the content from time to time via "CuteFTP".

Initially I am going to develop a new site, get it up and running, then bring down the old one.

I am a programmer who has done some Visual Basic, Embedded VB, and Palm programming so I am not afraid of web dev tools (no C lang please). I am also not afraid of investing in the toolset that will give me what I need down the road. I will want E-Commerce availability and possibly database as well. After poking around this site a bit and reading posts, I feel like this is the place to start my journey.

Though my current business has nothing to do with the web (I sell a Palm based product to crime prevention professionals like the police and insurance companies believe it or not). I am not opposed to gaining enough skills to make some money off web dev.

Here are a few of my questions...

What software to use to create a website. Dreamweaver??? or what. Don't wish to spend $$ but will consider all.

What about hosting. How much is too much. Can (should) I host my own site? I just paid $180.00 for a year of hosting existing site? Good deal?

Need E Commerce. I already have credit card processing capability for my business. Can I convert to use on my site?

What about driving customers to my site? How to do?

I have some ideas that appear to need database capability, ie. want my existing custs be sign in to a "private" area.

How do I end up with a "unique" site, not cookie cutter. Not looking for "wizz bang" but professional.

Do I need to hire someone to "frame-up" a basic site that I take over?

On and on...

Any comments will be appreciated.

Christian_SEO · #2 (**permalink**) 12-06-2003, 01:44 AM

What software to use to create a website. Dreamweaver??? or what. Don't wish to spend $$ but will consider all.

There are tons of HTML tools that range from free to expensive. DreamWeaver is the pros choice, but there are many good ones. I would go to a shareware site (cnet.com has reviews) and download a few to try them. Since you can program I would encourage you to learn some basic HTML with NotePad. It will allow you to get in and fix some things or make quick changes. But a WYSIWYG editor is a big time-saver for putting nice looking pages together.

What about hosting. How much is too much. Can (should) I host my own site? I just paid $180.00 for a year of hosting existing site? Good deal?

You can host your own site, but if your serious about your business, yo won't. Your time is better spent on the business, and your cash (server, software, fast connection,...) is better spent on the business. A good hosting account should not run more than $30 a month unless you have massive requirements.

At $15 you're about average these days, but it all depends on what you're getting. For $10-15 a month you should be getting more than you need in everything. But the other factor is how good is the customer service of your isp? They should be responsive, knowledgable, and friendly. They should not have more than a few hours of downtime a year, or something like that. That is, it should not be a regular feature of the site.

Need E Commerce. I already have credit card processing capability for my business. Can I convert to use on my site?

This is a little complex for a simple answer. You can take orders on the site and hand process the CCs, but it may be better to have it happen automatically. you may be able to use your merchant account on the site, I'd give them a call. What you may need then is a gateway account. The gateway account is what your web site talks to and then talks to your bank. You pay for the merchant account and you pay for the gateway. Some can be one in the same. I'm not an expert here, but that's the main idea.

What about driving customers to my site? How to do?

Internet marketing - big subject also and this is my area of expertise, so I'm a little biased, but you should optimize and submit your site to the search engines and directories (search engine optimization or SEO). You can do this yourself or hire someone to do it for you. If you hire someone, expect to pay from several hundred dollars (if you pay less you are unlikly to be getting the full, professional treatment), to several thousands of dollars. After SEO you can try pay-per-click serach engines, banner advertising, e-zine and blog advertising, email advertising, etc. SEO is the best value for your money, in our opinion, but you will want to do more than just that.

I have some ideas that appear to need database capability, ie. want my existing custs be sign in to a "private" area.

With your programming background you should have no problem, but you'll have to learn a few things. You will most likly want to program in ASP, since you know VB, but if you learn PHP you can have your site on Windows or UNIX servers, for the most part.

There are several ways to take care of security issues, both on the server and in programming.

How do I end up with a "unique" site, not cookie cutter. Not looking for "wizz bang" but professional.

Well, it's hard to be really "unique" with a billion sites out there, but if you are somewhat artistic you can use layout, color and graphics to do something good. There are a number of sites that sell "templates" or whole sites that are empty that you can use to start with. You add your graphics and text and make it your own. Be careful though, there are a lot of really bad free templates. I would try to find one that costs $10-50 and it should look and work better.

Do I need to hire someone to "frame-up" a basic site that I take over?

No. If you get a nice template site it's about the same thing. However, you can get someone that does this stuff all the time and get a site thrown together for a few hundred dollars to maybe $1,000.

I hope this helps...

By the way, I took a look at your site, and it's pretty cool! Not the site, but the product! Actually, the site is not all that bad. I would go with a very clean design. Simple white and grey, good font to give it a more modern look, and some better photos to show how it all works. It took me a while to figure out why I would care about your product, but now that I understand it, it's very cool. You should do very well with this, you just need to clean things up a little and get some marketing going.

Corey Bryant · #3 (**permalink**) 12-06-2003, 10:35 AM

Quote:

What software to use to create a website. Dreamweaver??? or what. Don't wish to spend $$ but will consider all.

I agree - use DW. If you know your HTML / CSS, you can even just use notepad. A lot of people do not like a WYSIWYG editor, but I let it start my design / template & then go back & edit the HTML. It saves me some time

Quote:

What about hosting. How much is too much. Can (should) I host my own site? I just paid $180.00 for a year of hosting existing site? Good deal?

$15 is a good price but what happens iin 6 months if you are not happy with them? Do you get your money back? I have use Hostway for about 4 years now & even re-selling them. I r-sell their hosting at a couple buck more a month & give my customer free HTML updates a month if needed. Makes them happy. Always happy with their service. If you are happy with them, stay there. Hosting companies are a dime a dozen but if you find someone that meets your needs, stay their. Don't host it. It also could be against your ISP TOS. If your server goes down while you are sleeping, it will be down until you wake up. At a hosting company, that will be taken care of immediately.

Quote:

Need E Commerce. I already have credit card processing capability for my business. Can I convert to use on my site?

Not really. You have what is called a brick and mortar account. You are probably paying 1.55% as a discount rate. And then if someone comes in & you have to key in their card, you might be paying 85 basis points or more for that transaction. An internet merchant account is about 2:30% or so. It could be against your merchant agreement as well if you checked off card present at all times.

Quote:

What about driving customers to my site? How to do?

Submit to search engines. Make sure your content is there. It all depends on what you are selling. Listen to Christian definetely about this one. We have one site that has a lot of competition, but a lot of hits that we have gotten & sales actually are from people typing in different search terms - terms that we never thought of but we are ranked number 1 & 2 on most search engines.

Quote:

I have some ideas that appear to need database capability, ie. want my existing custs be sign in to a "private" area.

Check to see - Windows or Unix? That will help to determine is you need to use ASP or PHP. If it is ASP, you can download a free login script at http://www.outfront.net/spooky/login.htm to give you an idea on the coding.

Quote:

How do I end up with a "unique" site, not cookie cutter. Not looking for "wizz bang" but professional.

Be careful - you might design something that you might not like but everyone else does. :) This has happened to me a lot. Or you love it & everyone else just hates it. We are our own worst critic.

Quote:

Do I need to hire someone to "frame-up" a basic site that I take over?

It depends on how comfortable you are with your work. I have a great programmer in .NET but he will not design anything. He even made it abundantly clear before we hired him that he is not a designer. So if you have some color coordination, etc - go for it.

I will say that is a pretty cool product as well. On http://www.markngard.com/auto_dealers.html you might consider also adding the scroll bar since that is what people look for. But the up / down feature is cool.

starrwriter · #4 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 12:14 AM

To redo your site from scratch, get the $89 Namo WebEditor (http://www.namo.com). It's WYSIWYG, very easy to learn and has database capability.

davebarnes · #5 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 01:40 PM

NEVER host your own site.

For $10-$100/mo, a hosting company will:
- update the operating system on a regular basis
- update the webserver on a regular basis
- update the server-side software (e.g., PHP, ASP, ColdFusion, H2O) on a regular basis
- apply all the security patches to the operating system in a timely manner
- apply all the security patches to the webserver in a timely manner
- arrange for multiple high-speed connections to multiple upstream providers
- have some poor bastard with a pager glued to his/her body in case the server stops
- upgrade/replace the computer hardware when it becomes inadequate

What I look for in a hosting company:
1. Humans who answer the phone.
2. People who know what they are doing.
3. A small (fewer than 25 employees) company that will work with you and customize what you need.

Hosting companies I like are:
www.hugehosting.com
www.peakpeak.com
www.comfluent.com

davebarnes · #6 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 01:53 PM

Editors.

Well, you have choice of WYSIWYG or raw-HTML coders.

1. For raw HTML, I prefer TopStyle from www.bradsoft.com
2. I have also used Ace HTML Pro from www.visicommedia.com
3. For WYSIWYG, I use daily (hourly?) Dreamweaver. It is worth every bit of its $400. You can buy DW4 or DW MX for less on Ebay. Don't buy DW3, it is too old.
4. I have played around with Namo and consider it to be OK. No reason for me to switch from DW.
5. Do NOT (repeat NOT) use MS FrontPage. It makes too many changes to your code.
6. Adobe GoLive is another editor to consider, but I know nothing about it. My only concern about Adobe products is that if the product doesn't meet Adobe's financial criteria, they drop it. In my opinion, GoLive could be a candidate as I don't think it gained the marketshare that Adobe wants.

,dave

sayasfx · #7 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 02:15 PM

What are your reasons for doing it yourself? Is it to save money or is it because you want to get into the web design business?

If your intention is to save money, I would suggest just hiring a professional to do this. There are a lot of professional designers who can design a website for you that's within your budget. Depending on what you want to achieve with your website, it may be wise to have a plan and strategy. Dont get fooled into thinking that just having a website will bring you business - this will just cost you more in the long run.

My suggestion is to shop around, surf the net and see how others are using their website to build their business and devise your own plan and strategies on how you plan to use your website with your business.

If you'd like some information on shopping for websites, we have a Buyers Resources section on our website.

beyondtraffic · #8 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 02:48 PM

Good Day, I have read all the replys that you received about hosting and HTM Software, The one thing I noticed is that no one gave you any help just a bunch of advice. So I am going to help, (lol)

If you will contact me at webmaster@haileyscometweekly.com

I will give you a FULL Virsion HTML editor that is easy to use and that will walk you step by step on getting started.

Then if you like I can hook you up with the fine people at Boaze Publishing that will work up a hosting account that will fit your needs, Just contact me and we will go from there.

Have a great day!
Damon Smith
Editor,HaileysComet Weekly News
http://www.haileyscometweekly.com
Marketing Director ISORegister

Malachim · #9 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 04:09 PM

Website
First off, the existing website. I'm old and grumpy so I don't do "gentle" - I think it's bloody awful. I could write a better one in half an hour.

The colours are off, especially that red background, the page isn't centred, nor optimised and it's riddled with browser specific code. (If IE 6 do this, else...) Blah! I won't comment on the flash logo at the start! Then there's the HTML itself... I could go on, but I won't.

Heck, there's only a few pages. Just ask and I'll do it for free, unconditionally so, put that out it's misery!

Back to the questions at hand.

Coding
You are a programmer, learn HTML. You could probably pick it up the basics in a day.
Use a text editor for the coding, I use the shareware Textpad ( www.textpad.com ) for virtually everything myself, but there's plenty of others.

Then look at validator like CSE HMTLValidator ( www.htmlvalidator.com ), which has a 30 day trial. It rocks. It is an editor itself, but many members here probably use it to check their code.

Similarly, and as soon as possible, learn about CSS.
Again, on a budget Bradsoft's TopStyle (www.bradsoft.com ) is extremely highly rated and there is a free 'lite' edition.

Graphics wise, you'll never find anyone fault PaintShopShop at the price. Again I thinks there's still a 30 day trial ( www.jasc.com )

Later on, if you see the worth, by all means look at Dreamweaver MX or the full MX Studio which, in my opinion, is much better value.

Hosting & ECommerce
Can't help with suggesting a specific host as I live on the wrong side of the Atlantic, but you've had good advice on what to look for.

Whether to go with a Windows or Linux at the server is a personal choice, though I prefer the latter. Both have the database support you need. Just make sure your host lets you use it :) Budget ones don't have this basic option. Also, others charge extra for the ASP option.

Ecommerce wise, (beyond the card charge issue), this is a whole new ball court, and not my speciality (yet). Better ISP's will have business class accounts with eCommerce and SSL built in. VeriSign ( www.verisign.com ) is a good site to look over for more information. You should also talk to your bank/credit card company over this, but there are other online card validation options.

Codewise you can do it yourself in PHP or ASP or use off the shelf ECommerce package - there are many.

The trickier aspect, as Amazon and others will affirm to their cost, is the legal side. Others will know better, but I believe that if you mess up the prices - like missing a nought - they are legally binding. New Ferrari for $4,000 ? I'll order a thousand! Actually is was digital cameras that I recall, but you get the gist.

Related, and always a concern, if you use a less that adequate option and some low-life cracker has it away with all your customers credit card details...

* What can I say, I'm paranoid :) *

websites of interest include...

Webmonkey on eCommerce: http://hotwired.lycos.com/webmonkey/e-business/
Verisign's (pdf) guide to eCommerce: http://www.verisign.com/rsc/gd/pmt/e...ommerce_gd.pdf
Ecommerce Guide.com: http://ecommerce.internet.com/

Another point to consider, beyond those mentioned is bandwidth.

5Gb/s ? Even less!? 10Gb/month? 30Gb/month? More?
Will they warn you as you approach the limit...
What are the penalties for going over - then can be steep...
Will they let you upgrade it easily...

What extra's do they have...
CGI bins ? Site submission* ? Spam filters ?

Site Promotion
There's lots of experts on this here.
www.highrankings.com is a brilliant site for this topic too.

My thoughts?
If you build it, they will come. Not a chance! Blood sweat and tears, matey :)
Seriously, you need:

A good product, which you appear to have.
A decent, easily navigatable layout and design.
Tight, appropriate code... This is is from optimised "meta's" and "alt" tag to Cross browser compatibility
Updated regularly. For both visitors and search engine spiders.
Regularly submitted to the top search engines (Every six weeks is considered good)

Basically, in my opinion and experience, if a site looks grotty, people won't come back and if you mess up the code side - usually folk trying to be 'clever' - then the search engines avoid you.
SEO is a moving target though, as they happily tell you.

Hope this helps.

(And yes, I meant the offer at the top!)

bbodenstein · #10 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 05:04 PM

Thanks to you all for the excellent comments and suggestions. I am encouraged and now need to make a few decisions. Will be back once I sort all this good data out.

kneelsit · #11 (**permalink**) 12-08-2003, 11:13 PM

You have a wealth of information there to chew over. However, I must take issue with Malachim on the suggestion of submitting to SEs every 6 weeks . Not necessary at all. I have not submitted to a SE in over 5 years yet I still come in the top ten ( often no 1 or 2 ) on Google, Yahoo, MSN, Alta Vista etc.

Different thing with directories - submit to as many as possible after you have optimised your site
Don't forget smaller ones such as Go Guide, Joe Ant, Gimpsy etc.

mbrink1111 · #12 (**permalink**) 12-09-2003, 12:13 AM

I am a programmer who has done some Visual Basic, Embedded VB, ...

>> You'll want to go with ASP using VBScript. You'll catch on fast. For online references for the various technologies that you'll be using you can find them at: http://www.devguru.com/home.asp

Though my current business has nothing to do with the web (I sell a Palm based product to crime prevention professionals like the police and insurance companies believe it or not).

>> Small world. I'm currently developing a web based application for the Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Department. Wouldn't suprise me if we work together in the future to make the app extendable to the Palm.

What software to use to create a website. Dreamweaver??? or what. Don't wish to spend $$ but will consider all.

>> For programming I use 1st Page 2000, it's free -
http://www.evrsoft.com/

I have some ideas that appear to need database capability, ie. want my existing custs be sign in to a "private" area.
How do I end up with a "unique" site, not cookie cutter. Not looking for "wizz bang" but professional.
Do I need to hire someone to "frame-up" a basic site that I take over?

>> Check out http://aspin.com/ . Chances are what you're looking for is already there. Find an app the most closely fits your needs then modify to suit.

>> For quick help from experienced ASP Developers you can sign up at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AspCla...yQuestionIsOk/

luck
Michael Brinkley
http://ASPAlliance.com/mbrink1111/

ronniethedodger · #13 (**permalink**) 12-16-2003, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbrink1111

What software to use to create a website. Dreamweaver??? or what. Don't wish to spend $$ but will consider all.

>> For programming I use 1st Page 2000, it's free -
http://www.evrsoft.com/

I too started using 1st Page, but soon switched over to HtmlKit which is also free. It is available at http://www.chami.com/html-kit/. It is hands down the best free Html editor out there.

But since you are a VB programmer, it may be easier and more natural for you to get into ASP programming with VB.NET. Keep in mind that you will need and ASP server to run these applications on.

ASP will allow you to do the database maintenance and coding in the style that you will also be more comfortable with.

On the flipside, for database work is the Apache Servers and mySQL servers that go with it for your database work. In this case you will have to learn a little PHP coding to interface with the database. Since, you noted above -- no C please -- it would appear that this route may be less attractive for you.

Not to bash any users of DreamWeaver or GoLive from Adobe, but I personally think that hand written code from even a simple text editor such as Notepad is the ideal way to go. The pages are leaner & meaner and not filled up with all of the pre-processing commands that these commercial editors dump into your Html.