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Submit Your Site For Review Need a fresh set of eyeballs to take a look at your site? Have a specific issue or question about some aspect of your layout, design or interface? This is the forum for you. When submitting your site, be sure to discuss what aspect you are looking for input on. Just posting a link with the word 'review' isn't appropriate.

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 10-24-2007, 05:16 PM
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Lightbulb Please review MissModesty.net

Hi! Just updated our site, experimenting with some ideas but anticipating a full redesign. I know it needs A LOT of work. We are definitely aware and gearing towards a complete redesign. This is why I am soliciting feedback. I know all the 100's of things that are wrong with the site... I want to know what you think will make it better! I need some great ideas for this site because I expect business to really pick up now for the holidays.

What I am looking for is actually feedback on "visual appeal." For example, should I use the purple wrapper or just plain white bg? The pages are all different right now because we are "experimenting" with different looks and feels. For example, in "Sets" you can view the price up front. Should we stick to this, or have them click on the product (allowing us to see which products get the most traffic- regardless of price) like in "earrings" page? Can you suggest a free template you know of that would cater to our theme (girly with pink hearts)?

Please let me know of any suggestions!

MissModesty.net

Last edited by jxm0tbp : 10-24-2007 at 06:54 PM. Reason: More Specific
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Old 10-24-2007, 06:20 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

I think it is horrible.

1."With Miss Modesty&copy;,<br>you are sure to get noticed!"&copy;
You clearly don't understand the differences among trademark, servicemark and copyright.

2. Frames! Even I (who used to love frames) stopped using them years ago--except for one special website. I can't see a single good reason for using frames on your website. You use frames, but open a new tab for the Paypal store. What?

3. Your contact email is gmail. I really want to send money to someone who hides behind a gmail address.

4. Your products images are not consistent with regards to color. You need a complete set of bespoke images. blue borders around your product images. Is it that difficult to add a style in your stylesheet? Oh yeah, you don't appear to have a stylesheet.

5. The entire website looks reminds of a guy standing on a corner in Chinatown trying to sell me a "genuine Rolex".

,dave
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Old 10-24-2007, 06:56 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

Thanks for your feedback!

We do have an @MissModesty.net email address, but are placing it on our website with the redesign. We are hoping to expand our list of clientele. We currently cater mostly to "tupperware style" parties and word of mouth referrals, so the gmail account is ok for now. Most, if not all, of our clients have already met us in person so they do not think we are hiding from them! But I definitely agree that it is unprofessional and we need to use our @MissModesty.net address.

If you have any suggestions on how to improve the site, that would be great! (For example: Maybe a cool flash intro, or should we stay away from this? Color Scheme?)
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Old 10-24-2007, 07:28 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

"A cool flash intro" Uhh NO!

If this is going to be more than a hobby and you want to actually run this as a business, I would say go hire a professional web design/marketing company with an established portfolio. Tell them what you want to accomplish and let them do their work. Dave is right on and you need to take his suggestions. There is so much more that I can't even begin to go into. Design, function and construction all need to be done over.

Typically modest people don't want to get noticed, so I guess I am a little confused by your positioning statement, "With Miss Modesty, you are sure to get noticed?" What exactly are you trying to get across here?
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Last edited by GunRunner : 10-24-2007 at 07:34 PM.
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Old 10-25-2007, 08:09 AM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

Cool Flash intro? can't remember ever seeing one.

Flash intros typically have two possible user responses:
1. find the 'skip intro' button as fast as you can
2. click the 'back' button to go back to the search results page and pick another site to shop
Why waste your time and money on something that will interfere with people seeing and buying your products?
Ok, so now that you're over the Flash intro, lets get over the frames; dave said it, I know I don't need to say it again, but I do second it. Ditch frames.

You already know you need a more professional e-mail address if you would like to collect revenue beyond the word of mouth crowd. It's a good crowd, to be sure, but if that's all you need, then you don't really need a web site, do you?

Use product names instead of 'details' under each product image, that is, unless you want to rank high in searches for the keyword 'details.' If your products don't have names, make some up. Be creative, descriptive, and use important key words. Your clients will appreciate it and so will the search engines.

Don't use graphic text for anything more than fancy buttons (if you must) or little images that say 'sale' or something that isn't really critical for search engines to see. If you must use a graphic for your logo (you are replacing that one you have there, aren't you? and why is each letter a separate image?) then use an CSS image replacement technique. Do a Yahoo or Google search on it if you don't know what I'm talking about.

You do realize that tables (as well as frames) take browsers longer to render than plain old text in <div/>s don't you?
The browser renders the table first, then, on a second pass, fills in the content. There are times when tables are appropriate to use, but don't over do it. And definitely get rid of all the junk like this, which I found no less than two times in the source code of your ring page content frame:
Code:
<tr>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
</tr>
This table is completely empty!!!

ok, so that is all the techy stuff for now; you are right, there is plenty to do, and I know you realize it. I hope that all of the things I have said were already on your list.

Now, for the user experience. What is your target? Looks to me like young adult women on a budget. Maybe even women in college or young professionals. Middle aged and grannys? maybe. You know who buys your kind of stuff, so now you need to think like them.

What kinds of things get their attention? What would be the difference between them browsing and buying? Not knowing your target demo myself, these are questions I cannot answer, but you need to know this. If you do, let it guide your design; if you don't you had better find out before you rewrite a single line of your code.

I agree with GunRunner that a successful site would probably best be designed by a pro, but even then you have some homework to do if you want to get the most for your $$$.

Whether you decide to do it yourself or hire a pro you need to do these things first:
1. figure out who buys your wares; they are your target demographic (you probably already have some idea)

2. find out what other sites they shop on; how much time they spend browsing on the web; whether or not they are busy people, or people with time to kill

3. find out whether or not they know what PayPal is (I am thinking of your message with your credit card graphic; you probably don't need that); if they feel comfortable making purchases online, etc...

4. get Steve Krug's book "Don't Make Me Think"; it's an easy non-technical read packed with 'obvious' things that will make a lightbulb go off over your head. It's cheap, yet invaluable at the same time (I wish I made a nickel each time I recommended this book). It will make you laugh at some of the stupid things people put on their sites, when you look at your site after reading it, you realize he could have been talking about you (don't panic, happens to all of us). Steve is that guy that holds up the mirror and gives us the first awkward glimpse at our real selves.

5. And if you really want to be successful, create a fictional user persona with some of the information you have collected: Sally Smith, 24 years old works as a receptionist for a doctor's office and makes $35k per year. She is also a student of business at community college.....
Then, when you have to make tough decisions about design direction or usability of your site, ask yourself and your team, "what would be more appealing/useful/convenient/logical etc... for Sally?"

Remember, the site is NOT for you... it's for your customer. Think like them, design for them, and if you have a question about which way to go with the site and you're not sure of the answer, find a real live Sally Smith and ask her.

Finally, if you decide to do it yourself, get up to speed on HTML 4 and/or XHTML; There is really no excuse for 1995 style coding on a modern site. We're all a bit too smart for that now. If you're not, then get smart now. Just be aware that designing your own site takes time... lots of time. Remember, for some people it's a career, so if you feel you're getting in over your head, don't be afraid to seek professional help. It will be worth the $$$ in the end as long as you did your homework ahead of time and you can clearly convey your objectives and describe your target audience.

Good luck.
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http://www.amorphicmedia.com

Last edited by amorphic8 : 10-25-2007 at 08:18 AM.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2007, 12:45 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 7
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Thumbs up Re: Please review MissModesty.net

Quote:
Originally Posted by amorphic8 View Post
Cool Flash intro? can't remember ever seeing one.

Flash intros typically have two possible user responses:
1. find the 'skip intro' button as fast as you can
2. click the 'back' button to go back to the search results page and pick another site to shop
Why waste your time and money on something that will interfere with people seeing and buying your products?
Ok, so now that you're over the Flash intro, lets get over the frames; dave said it, I know I don't need to say it again, but I do second it. Ditch frames.

You already know you need a more professional e-mail address if you would like to collect revenue beyond the word of mouth crowd. It's a good crowd, to be sure, but if that's all you need, then you don't really need a web site, do you?

Use product names instead of 'details' under each product image, that is, unless you want to rank high in searches for the keyword 'details.' If your products don't have names, make some up. Be creative, descriptive, and use important key words. Your clients will appreciate it and so will the search engines.

Don't use graphic text for anything more than fancy buttons (if you must) or little images that say 'sale' or something that isn't really critical for search engines to see. If you must use a graphic for your logo (you are replacing that one you have there, aren't you? and why is each letter a separate image?) then use an CSS image replacement technique. Do a Yahoo or Google search on it if you don't know what I'm talking about.

You do realize that tables (as well as frames) take browsers longer to render than plain old text in <div/>s don't you?
The browser renders the table first, then, on a second pass, fills in the content. There are times when tables are appropriate to use, but don't over do it. And definitely get rid of all the junk like this, which I found no less than two times in the source code of your ring page content frame:
Code:
<tr>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
<td>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</td>
<td><center>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;<br></td>
</tr>
This table is completely empty!!!

ok, so that is all the techy stuff for now; you are right, there is plenty to do, and I know you realize it. I hope that all of the things I have said were already on your list.

Now, for the user experience. What is your target? Looks to me like young adult women on a budget. Maybe even women in college or young professionals. Middle aged and grannys? maybe. You know who buys your kind of stuff, so now you need to think like them.

What kinds of things get their attention? What would be the difference between them browsing and buying? Not knowing your target demo myself, these are questions I cannot answer, but you need to know this. If you do, let it guide your design; if you don't you had better find out before you rewrite a single line of your code.

I agree with GunRunner that a successful site would probably best be designed by a pro, but even then you have some homework to do if you want to get the most for your $$$.

Whether you decide to do it yourself or hire a pro you need to do these things first:
1. figure out who buys your wares; they are your target demographic (you probably already have some idea)

2. find out what other sites they shop on; how much time they spend browsing on the web; whether or not they are busy people, or people with time to kill

3. find out whether or not they know what PayPal is (I am thinking of your message with your credit card graphic; you probably don't need that); if they feel comfortable making purchases online, etc...

4. get Steve Krug's book "Don't Make Me Think"; it's an easy non-technical read packed with 'obvious' things that will make a lightbulb go off over your head. It's cheap, yet invaluable at the same time (I wish I made a nickel each time I recommended this book). It will make you laugh at some of the stupid things people put on their sites, when you look at your site after reading it, you realize he could have been talking about you (don't panic, happens to all of us). Steve is that guy that holds up the mirror and gives us the first awkward glimpse at our real selves.

5. And if you really want to be successful, create a fictional user persona with some of the information you have collected: Sally Smith, 24 years old works as a receptionist for a doctor's office and makes $35k per year. She is also a student of business at community college.....
Then, when you have to make tough decisions about design direction or usability of your site, ask yourself and your team, "what would be more appealing/useful/convenient/logical etc... for Sally?"

Remember, the site is NOT for you... it's for your customer. Think like them, design for them, and if you have a question about which way to go with the site and you're not sure of the answer, find a real live Sally Smith and ask her.

Finally, if you decide to do it yourself, get up to speed on HTML 4 and/or XHTML; There is really no excuse for 1995 style coding on a modern site. We're all a bit too smart for that now. If you're not, then get smart now. Just be aware that designing your own site takes time... lots of time. Remember, for some people it's a career, so if you feel you're getting in over your head, don't be afraid to seek professional help. It will be worth the $$$ in the end as long as you did your homework ahead of time and you can clearly convey your objectives and describe your target audience.

Good luck.

Thank you SSSOOOOO much Amorphic8, this is exactly what I was looking for! I really appreciate everyone's feedback!
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Old 10-25-2007, 07:37 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

I agree with everything said above. And there are a few other things.

That glittery animated header graphic is somewhat annoying. I feel like I wandered into MySpace by mistake.

"Couture" has a very specific meaning. You better look it up in the dictionary since your use of the word is disappointing potential buyers, and is misleading at best and possibly fraudulent at worst.

Use a shopping cart script. The paypal cart is not very good, and it's possible for geekytypes to alter prices in it. CubeCart or ZenCart would do the job nicely, and payment processing can still be handled by paypal. Get hosting on its own IP and get a secure server cert in your name. And definitely get a nice pro design done. You have ten seconds from the time the page loads to make an impression. If you don't make a good one, people move on. And if things are unprofessional further in, you will not develop the trust you need for people to actually buy your merch.

Your product descriptions are sparse and have few, if any, keywords/keyphrases.
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Old 10-25-2007, 08:45 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

Hi

Can not help but say you have had good advice to date. We actively encourage and train small business owners to build their sites when this is sensible but I would recommend that you do not do this. Selling jewellery online is not that easy and your presentation skills are unsuitable for the product. Each of the pages you have posted make the items look cheap and tawdry. Sorry if that sounds harsh but for you, accepting a little design help will pay off.

Couldn't fail to comment on amorphic's post. Quite rare to see such a good combination of technical and business sense, you need to give someone like that a call.
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Old 10-26-2007, 01:44 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

I'm currently working on the homepage and have made some changes to it. I hope this is better! Remember, it's just a start... I know I still have a long way to go! Let me know what you think...
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Old 10-26-2007, 02:06 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

You need to study up on image processing. Especially with the image on the right, it's obvious you further compressed an already compressed image and the quality is pretty bad.

If an image is a 72 dpi jpg it cannot be processed further without gross loss of quality, which is what happened here.

As others have suggested, maybe you should just pay someone else to do this, instead of trying to do it yourself. The page also has validation errors, which boggles my mind since it's such a simple page. WebDev involves a lot of different skills.

Last edited by bj : 10-26-2007 at 02:14 PM.
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Old 10-29-2007, 01:29 PM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

I guess I was late to the party - but for a simple site - it seems fine to me. I'm guessing you've responded to some of the suggestions already made.

I haven't followed it through the ordering process, but the three selections seem fine, and I rather like the opening page - simple clean design.

For the people urging you to get a professional design done - I think some of that is self-interest (they make a living DOING professional designs.) IMHO - a talented small business person, using some off-the-shelf packages can make a perfectly acceptable design all by themselves, without the help of the pros.

Where the professional value will pay off for you - is search engine optimization. In this case - staying on top of what search engines are doing and how to optimize your website for them (so you get organic - free - results) is almost a full time job, and a SEO expert can help you get a better return on your advertising $$.

Good luck with your website - I think it looks good and like the simple design.
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Old 11-13-2007, 12:32 AM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

I think for someone who is trying to tackle a website on their own you page looks great. BJ needs to follow her own advise and update her website. You cannot be a veteran BJ.
Miss Modesty is a good concept and your doing fine. there are however some really nice carts out there that aren't to expensive and you could get a beautiful template for you jewelry store and customize it from there.
plus the admin interface is so much easier than just writing html and checking your paypal.
So keep up the good work and if you need a hand, let me know.
Steve
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Old 11-13-2007, 08:18 AM
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Default Re: Please review MissModesty.net

Quote:
BJ needs to follow her own advise and update her website.
LOL! Yeah, you're right. Too bad I'm too busy with client sites to do anything with my own . . .
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Old 11-21-2007, 11:52 AM
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Wink Re: Please review MissModesty.net

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevebcali View Post
I think for someone who is trying to tackle a website on their own you page looks great. BJ needs to follow her own advise and update her website. You cannot be a veteran BJ.
Miss Modesty is a good concept and your doing fine. there are however some really nice carts out there that aren't to expensive and you could get a beautiful template for you jewelry store and customize it from there.
plus the admin interface is so much easier than just writing html and checking your paypal.
So keep up the good work and if you need a hand, let me know.
Steve
Thanks Stevebcali! It's definitely a work in progress... Hopefully we'll get there soon!
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