With such an abundance of web expertise on the net, one would think that rates have gone down. But no, i still see quotes at $1000 and more for a website.

I won't go into details - those who need a website done would have scouted around and know what i am talking about. Point is if you need a no-frills professional looking website from a webpro who has a proven track record (braglist of clients), look no further - our rates start at US$199 for 4-page website with your standard "about us", "products" or "services", "contact us" and "order form" pages (of course, these are just examples - your sitemenu can be anything you want).

Mind you, this includes one-year's web hosting on a shared server! And if we like you, we'll throw in some bells and whistles at no charge :) We pride ourselves in developing sites that makes sense of your presence on the net. We take the trouble to know what your objectives are and get it done right first time. You save time, and costs. AND you can start your eBusiness right away instead of trying to pull together $1000 for a website that honestly can't do much more - ok, depends on who you hire!

This is not a one-time belt-tightening offer - our rates are published on the net for all to see. You can check us out at eShopWEBs.com

There is a reason why companies charge $1000 for a website: Because the website is worth $1000.

There are not many websites that we do for less than that because it is always been and always will be that "You Get What You Pay For", and the customer knows that.

We build websites that get results. We build websites that are profitable. I don't care who you are, or what business it is, if someone wants a website, they want to make MONEY! If that website isn't properly developed and doesn't have a "Marketing Plan", than it is not even worth $199, even if the $199 website has 100 pages, and is the best design and the "prettiest" webiste in the world.

We create statistic reports and research that are far more advance than any hosting package has to offer. We conduct extensive research about the company, its industry, its customers, and a whole lot more way before we even start to put a proposal together. Then we find out what works and what doesn't work. If it is $1000, and the customer knows that it is worth it, they will pay and more than often choose us over the $199 sites.

The point is that "Price" is not often a facter. I would pay someone $50,000 for a website that will make me money, but I would never spend $50 for a "Cheap" website.

I am not writing this to be rude at all. That is not who I am. I am writing this to inform all the people in our industry that "Price" is catchy, but it doesn't sell.

I will end here because I could go on writing for hours on this subject.

Take care,

Brian Evans
www.communicationassoc.com

Im with brian. There are so many people out there living in near 3rd world countries with a 266 on Win 95 advertising as webdesigners prices are plummeting. It takes time and expertise to create a good cross-browser site that fully validates and works for blind and partially sighted persons screen readers. It would be interesting for Altzens to post his portfolio of baked bean priced websites here and let users decide.

Im a pretty staright talking person who defines cheap as "cheap". One lesson will remain true in every side of life Altzens, and that is "you get what you pay for"!

Some Lodon based agencies charge well in excess of £5,000 for 15 page sites. Why? Well they have qualified proffesional staff, offices, insurance, good systems and software to support,etc. Not everyone hacks up poor sites on decrepid old calculators from yesteryear with broken CTRL/ALT and DELETE keys in their bedroom.

Thank you. It's people like you who make my qualified clients with whom I've spent much time decide to go with a cheap website. And that's just what it'll be. Cheap. I gave my prospect a quote cheaper than what the GAG handbook suggested, and he decided to go with someone who's going to build him a Flash site for $500.00! These people are the reason we can't charge what we're worth. A web designer is a professional. It takes intensive training at school, and my time and experience is worth more than $199.00.

With regards altzens original post, why does a Rolls Royce cost well in excess of £100,000 and a Skoda under £10<000. Because a Skoda is manufactured using budget skills and budget materials by budget labour in a budget country.

The remarks about quality are well noted, and sustainable when reviewing Page Rank and validateable code used and represented here but, let's don't forget that we are also talking "Scales of Economy" here:

199.00 USD United States Dollars = 8,261.18 THB Thailand Baht

I would imagine that 8,261 Thailand Baht has much more buying power in Thailand than $199 USD has in the US. Most families spend that much on groceries here every week.

Ken

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Bottom line is you get what you pay for. no offence but when you offer a complete website with hosting for 199 then you get something that is worth 199 i.e. nothing. just being happy knowing you have some kind of web presense vs getting a good website are 2 different things. i would not touch a client who tells me he wants to just spend 199. waste of time.

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There is much worse than selling a cheap site at 199 dollars: selling it at much much much more! It happened to two of my clients of mine. The first one paid 3,750 $ for four pages (index, products, contacts and a form) and hosting, the second almost 5,000 $ for a 15-page maze plus hosting plus a logo. Before rebuilding them from scrap I teleported both sites as a souvenir.

Valeria

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Whist in full agreeance smakyyy, with reference Altzens original post for websites for $199. Surely any reputable website designer would have a nice site, with no garish colours, and quality code. <flood6 edit: Forum Rules> If people actually sat back and learned to code instead of heading straight to hotscripts for some open source that was valid pre 1985 the web would be a far finer place, and a sight more pleasurable.

Hi,

In the US we are up to our hips in doctors and lawyers, but I don't see them lowering their prices.

Have Fun,
Jeff

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Ah well Jeff you reside in the United Claims of America.


Big$'s Compensation claim = Layer + Doctors report.

You get what you pay for, for sure. And as for prices. Where I am from companies can pay £3000.00 for one full page in the local press for one day. £5000.00 for a complete site is peanuts in comparison. I have heard of a motorbike oil company paying £20'000.00 for a flash site. Prices in my mind will go up sharply as more and more peeps come online with ADSL ( in the UK anyhow ) more and more people are now spending more time infront of the PC rather that the TV. THAT IS QUITE AMAZING. Consider how much TV adverts cost companies. Then evaluate your pricing structure.

One more thing

php~pro I have to disagree very strongly with you. Validation is by no way the measure of a professional and well designed site. In fact I would go this far to say that I find that it is very very restrictive in way to many ways. Also if we only make sites that validate we are holding our self's back. Instead of pushing things forward,

I aint going to be tied to W3C to govern my creativity.

look at a great deal of to top sites.....they don't give a damn about W3C either.

Why is everyone jumping all over this guy? He is entitled to make a living just the same as you are. Many of you act like you are fighting for your livelihood - like he is taking something away from you.

If you do not agree with him, you do not need to attack him. Let him be!!! There is enough work for everyone and he is entitled to his opinion.

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Some interesting comments especially those relating to the core design of a website in reference to SEO etc.
Myself for basic 4 page websites and hosting of same I start at 150euro(build & 1st year hosting - 70euro hosting thereafter including free domain name or 50euro if you get your own).
I'm not going to say that a $1000 site is better or not but I know I can take a suite with no outlay on SEO into the top listings on most of the major search engines. I have a site done in html 4.01 (with frames) consistently in the top 5 placements and via the top search string for this product! I consistently beat my competition in this area and I know for sure most are using Optimization techniques.

So I'll sit on the fence but will say that from what I've seen a lot of what I see and read is total rubbish. I seriously do not see the advantage in paying out xxxx thousand as opposed to xxx hundreds.
The sites I'm competing with in my example all cost more than mine, that much is obvious, (till i get the new design up that is, in xhtml 1.1/.css 2.0). Yet with absolutly no outlay in SEO I am consistantly better than my competition in these areas, so no I don't think the actual value of a site in design has an affect as such in these areas.

I do agree though that with the advent of third world designers that it is having a profound effect on the industry and that I have had no choice but to drop my prices. A lot more work involved from that aspect and annoying at that, but thats the internet as they say.

Inexperienced developers (designers) that think highly of themselves tend to charge higher. Go with someone that does it frequently. Note, I'm not saying go with those that try to make living by doing that.

Web design is the area saturated by armatures that confuse software capabilities with their own talent.

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"Web design is the area saturated by amateurs that confuse software capabilities with their own talent." ~~ me

You Get What You Pay For!
This rule always works. If you spent 1000$ for a site, it will be worth 1000$.

The services of good professionals are always expensive. If you want unique design and clean coding you should be ready to spend thousand not hundreds.

If you want to spend only 200$ -- it`s better to spend a couple of days and combine a site according to different tutorials yourself. It`ll be more useful for your brains...(kind of joke)

Even if you are good professional from a third world country your rates will grow together with your experience and professionalism. You will charge less, of course, then US and EU designers and coders, but the difference will not be so great.

If you are ready to develop a site for 200$ so you value yourself and your own skills and so consider that you`re worse than others...

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Alex Yuruts - agu@intetics.com

Intetics Co
Web & software development company

I have seen clients pay inflated prices of over 10K for a 30 or less page site they are sold on design and as times change they find simple upgrades or changes halter heavy price tags.
I have seen many designers sell sites for less then 199usd there are many that give 5 page sites for $50 and you get 5 pages of worthless design.
It is possible for someone to make a great site and charge little money but this only hurts our industry even more someone who spends 100’s of hours working on a site clocking in $1 an hour this is futile.
It is the lack or a regulation on a standardization of fees that hurts all the most.
A mechanic has a rating of how long it takes to repair or replace a part and they have the value of that repair a great mechanic can do it faster but is rewarded for his skill and a poor mechanic is slow and does not make as much but the customer is protected and on the whole prices are standardized across the board.
This holds true in almost every trade industry but in our economy people continually damage our self worth as professionals but gauging people with overpricing or selling worthless work and ruining the credibility or developers.
When ever I worked somewhere not as a IT professional and I was asked to perform a IT function I refuse to do so without being properly compensated to the task rated according to my experience and the task at hand. This did not win me any brownie points but it protects the value of the IT professional.
I only hope that one day soon we as professionals can have a backbone of standardized pricing.

What are you worth
4 pages would take me 10 minutes 200 for 10 minutes puts me at a rate of 1200 an hour but if I optimize and create custom images and perform research to the client their competition and the clients goals to make a profitable site I may spend 100’s if not 1000’s of hours, and with Canada’s minim wages that means I would be braking the law to charge less then 6.85 and hour and minimum is not suitable to any highly trained professional.
I could lure people in charge them very little money and give them garbage and make a great deal of money but I am the one that has to sleep at night with it on my mind what I would be lowering myself to what I am doing to my industry and how I take advantage of the clients that I would have.
I like my sleep and I have a strong conscious so this is sacrilegious to me.

It has bean said here many times and it is true in life you get what you pay for the largest sites and most profitable ones have spent up to millions on continua’s development and every penny well spent.

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Everything you can find At Toronto

Hello Guys,

I have Read and understand about website prices. Here I must say that it all depends on the company structure who designed websites. Not all the companies have physical place. They have free lancers to design them a website so they are cheaper than those comapnies who have dedicated place and have professional staff.

Always believe those companies have physical location with dedicated professional staff like we have here in Pakistan.

So it is to inform all members of this thread that COUNTRY LOCATION differenciates the website designing price than other countries.

If anybody interested to design a static website . DO SEND US INFO at

info@webiff.com
Voice : +92-221+785237
+92-221-787214
Cell : +92-300-9370063


Regards,
Furqan Durvesh
Project Manager

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Be it right or wrong, you are of course entitled to express your opinion, Furqan Durvesh. Fortunately no-one is obligated to agree with it.

Wow. Jesus Mamimbo.

I am incredibly happy that there are companies like the originators of this post that go out and charge 199 dollars for a website. Our firm specializes in coming to the rescue of companies who get caught in their clutches. I mean,C'mon!! You said:

You got a cute little walking elephant on your website!! How precious is that? Professional? Not today. Not last week either.

Our firm uses no base price. None. We don't have a minimum or maximum. We are highly qualified paid professionals who do not work at fixed fees, because creating a professional website is both an art and a science. A website is not the right marketing vehicle for all companies. If a company or organizatin wants a 200 dollar website, then they do not take their website seriously. We don't even tell them to go to "smaller" companies, we tell them to by FrontPage. If however, they take their website seriously, then they come to us.

I sincerely apologize for getting on a high horse here, and sounding very holier than too, but I have had much too much experience dealing with these little website builders with FrontPage and a few animated gif's who think they are playing in the same sandbox that I am. They are not. There are designers who have posted here that are real professionals and artists, both technically and visually, and are so far above the poster that it seems silly.

You are not in our sandbox. Not today or tommorow.

You have got to be kidding me. I went to your site, I found four different fonts on the same page, broken links, and when I finally found your PORTFOLIO (that's what it's called son) I was not suprised to find websites with, three guesses, broken links, backrounds that completey overpowering the content, and a plethora of bad HTML and questionable design.

199 bucks. Good work, you really hustle... ah, uhm, I mean EARNED it.

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Gee, looks like i ruffled some feathers ...
But no worries, i take no offence to any of the views generated here. In fact, i would say it benefits potential website clients looking to hire.

There's always two sides to a coin. Does not matter how you make your case, no two scenarios are identical - there is the subject-matter of the site, the attitude/needs of the client, budget-constraints and a host of other factors peculiar to your locality and region of expertise. How you sell is up to you. Standadized pricing (if mooted) is country-specific subject to local laws governing the "profession". People fly to some Asian countries for dental treatment or plastic surgery simply because it is cheaper for no lack of standards. In fact some of the world's best surgeons are here in the Far East - and thankfully, they don't charge zillions. But that is not to say that those who do charge are wrong to do so. Just that clients have a choice. That's my point.

Which was apparently missed or perhaps, not clear. My averments can only relate to comparing two similar websites of the same professionalism and presence and then asking why should one cost much more?

Needless to say, if one goes to great lengths to belt out a site of outstanding facets, there's nothing wrong with charging what it's worth knowing the client can afford it and if not, he can look elsewhere. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. In that case, yes, "you get what you pay for". But to compare a "no frills" site with a Goliath blockbuster and denigrate it, you don't insult the author, you insult the client.

In any event, thank you all for posting as it offers some insights as to why folks charge more and it is ultimately the clients who decide if they are getting what they paid for. And if one is getting an identical breast-implant surgery done for lots less in a country other than one's own, it is not inconceivable that one would chose the former, all else being equal.

With deference to "amberstar702", a WebPro Veteran, i can only add that a forum to my mind, is where we can exchange views, and learn from the resulting knowledge base. I trust everyone meant well.

As much as the phrase "you get what you pay for" may have negative connotations, from a client's perspective, it also means one has to settle for what one can afford. And if we have a chance to compare options, we will settle for a site that in our opinion (which is subjective to the beholder) gives more value for less, surely. Is this the reason for "outsourcing"? The jury is still out. It is said that the internet levels the playing field and makes "free market enterprise" almost iconic. Ah, but that's a subject for another post ...

I don’t have feathers!!!!


For a point of fact most of the worlds best surgeons are in north America, and if you fly to china and the dentist messes up the procedure you will have no coverage or guarantee just an expensive mouth full of problems.

Please give an example of two sites of the same professionalism and presence one being excessively low cost and the other a respected firm I am willing to compare with proof or factual examples and not vague comparison.

It is not just a matter of what it is worth certain things take a certain amount of time and unless you are using templates and such you will invest x amount of hours and everywhere in the world has wage standards of labor and you times that by x and you have a minimum price less then that and well that is a whole new topic.


Well the implant has a certain value it costs x amount and if you charged less then the implant was worth and said it was the same then something is not right their. Why is it people fly all the way around the world to Canada begging for help with their medical problems with your theory it would be better to go to china.


We inform and enlighten people so they cannot be taken advantage of

Here is the problem the inter net is not just about the eye of the client it is about their needs not what they may think they want but what they really need and if you do not identify that you are taking advantage of your client. I have had clients that wanted things a certain way because they think that will work but what they want is not what the mass populous of the internet want and they need to be made clearly aware of this before you make them a site.

You speak in general and what you say is not true in general I will admit in specific clients can get work below value for a number of reasons a company just starting up needing clients someone trying to build their portfolio but both situations I mentioned come with drawbacks less experience no stability.

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Everything you can find At Toronto

Wow, I'm still in shock. People actually pay thousands of dollars for websites!? I guess I never investigated the cost of a website. I mean, I can understand Amazon.com or eBay or K-Mart paying that kind of money, but the average Joe... I think I'll just continue to build my own.

I agree with Ken (way up there) that costs can really be relative. If someone can live on $50 per week (supporting a family of 10), then they don't have to charge $5000. They could just charge $199 and do very well. That doesn't mean they're not talented.

That's whats crazy about the web... it's global. The standard of living varies everywhere... So I could give someone $199 to build my website, but for them it might translate into $5000!

But of course it's also dependent on quality. I can appreciate what it takes to set up an entire website, completely optimized, filled with content, all the other bells & whistles and then, on top of that, planted with a marketing plan. The time I spent designing my own site could have been used to make money somewhere else and then I could have turned around and used that money to pay someone to build my site.... actually that might turn out even... and besides, what fun is that. I enjoy doing it all myself. I'm here because I'm having fun!

Also the buyers comfort can be justified in the price. You know you're getting professional results. I personally don't really have the comfort designing my own sites... all I can do is learn as I go and hope what I learn is accurate. Trial & Error. If you hire a professional, there is probably less tension.

The price could also be justified by the time it saves you. But if it doesn't save you any time... If you get a crappy $199.00 website (as an example), and you still have to spend months after that getting the thing to generate income (if it does at all), it's probably worth $199 because you've spent thousands of your own dollars after that (time=money). But, if you spent $5000 and started making money right out of the gate.... it's a horse a piece.

I'm rambling...

Good thread, I've learned a lot.

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Actually the amazons and the e-bays have paid millions to develop their sites for a small business to pay a few thousand for a site is not much in the grand schema of things it is around the cost of one years listings in a phone book for most cities.

As I said I do admit there are rare occurrences of this being occurring but it is more charity work for whatever reason the designer has. If someone lives on $50 a week they have to pay to learn have to pay for their internet pay for the software they use the list goes on and on design is not without cost so unless they are designing on stolen software and cutting other corners they have to recoup their costs before they can make anything.

I still have yet to see one example of a 200 site comparing to a 5000 unless the 5000 design was a rip off witch people get scammed every day. Of the 200 was done at charity standards or slave labor.

You enjoy it that is great but if you do tab up all your hours and times that by the minimum wage for your area what do you get? This is just going by wage standards and not against skilled it professional rates (witch vary too much to use as a guideline)

Also faster results usually web firms have teams to work on projects.

What’s all this talk about horses?

No I’m rambling

I concur

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I 100% agree with you .

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I agree. The varied living standards around the world may be a factor in low prices in the less-developed countries. But this factor alone cannot justify anybody offering to work for 85% to 90% less of the going rate in the developed economies of the world.

It is simply not about, charging enough to cover your grocery bills. You have to account for

1. Expertise
2. Learning
3. Internet Connectivity Charges
4. Software Costs
5. Hardware Costs
6. Training
7. Employee Salaries
8. Employee Bonuses
9. Overhead expenses
10. Other incidental costs

Although the dollar may be worth more in a third world country for buying groceries. But corresponding costs of the other things I mentioned above, more or less diminishes the buying power of the mighty US dollar to a great extent.

For example, when I started my company (SEO) we used to work for a lot less then the going rate, but as we gained expertise, expanded our staff strength, etc. we simply weren't able to undercut our rates by 70% to 80%.

Almost all the reputable IT sourcing companies here, in India, does the job for not more then 25 to 30% less then the US rates.

So a $5000 can be done here for atleast at $3000.00 to $3500.00. No less. Looking to pay $199.00 for that kind of work, is simply inviting the fly-by-night operators, who will take your money and do the famous Indian Magic Trick of disappearing into thin air.
[/quote]

In my experience (my own company and a select few others excepted) you get less than you pay for. Many of my clients before coming to me paid in excess of $5000 for sites that frankly I wouldn't have dared put on the internet. So applying this rule to rock bottom prices, then a $150 site will be simply awful. However, I dont think price has much to do with the design you get at the end, whether you are charged $500 or $5000, you are really paying for customer service and the right to make updates and have input into the design. Having said that those afore mentioned $5000 webdesigners did not budge when my clients told them they didnt like the site, oh well, more custom for JKomp :)

Bottom line - get references, demand examples and make sure whoever you decide to make your website for you keeps you updated.

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When it comes down to it, all the "spare room" designers should stop cheapening the professional designers skills.

How about on demand attention to your clients needs, weekly tweaking to improve SERPS, a marketing plan to help get your clients started in web advertising, re-marketing of the clients product to help increase awareness, full submission to all the major search engines, submission to hundreds of directories, one-on-one contact during the design process, custom design from the start NO TEMPLATES, full research of client and clients competitors, continued research of clients competitors, I could go on and on about what my clients get when they spend a few thousand dollars for a website.

Don’t call yourself a professional designer if you don't provide a professional service. There is a huge difference between someone that charges $199.00 for a site and a true professional that provides a complete and client focused service.

Charging $199.00 for a website is like setting up a hotdog stand next to a 5 star restaurant, if you want a quick fix - grab a dog and hope you don't get sick - If you want a meal - make a reservation.

Jason Tor

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This thread should probably be in another topic.

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I would agree, what are those moderators up to? Christmas shopping?

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IMO - Pricing and Quality are 2 primary concerns of anyone offering design services or wanting to purchase them.

Ken

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IMO - Pricing and Quality go hand in hand. If your doing websites for $30.00 then you need to do a lot more to break even.

This means less time spent on quality websites and more time spent on finding your next client.

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