Will MSN win the International SE Market with Localisation?

[luismorais]

With the recent launch of Overture in Latin-America, Yahoo seems to be following quickly with its plan to establish itself in the Latin-American Market where Google still does not bite as strongly as other local search engines.

Nevertheless, both Google and Yahoo at times seem to have forgotten that although Internet at least in Brazil is a class a an b niche, the recent moves of the Government to make IT accessible to classes c and d might require that not only search results are more relevant for the Portuguese speaking population but their interface itself.

As Brazil's economy picks up, a more patriotic, if not nationalistic feeling fills up every strata of society, questioning why Brazilians when doing their search should have the extra work of deselecting the default 'search all web' which brings up English results by selecting the second option 'searches in portuguese only' in Yahoo or in Google's case: 'searches in Portuguese' or 'searches in Brazil'. None of those services seem to know how uncomfortable that is, mostly when along with the Portuguese results, several Spanish results flock in.

MSN on the other hand, although still not very robust as its competitors, seems to be starting in the right tone. The unnecessary options 'search all the web', 'search pages in Portuguese' and 'search in Brazil' are simply not there to confuse or irritate anyone. This approach is simply the best of them all from a localisation point of view.

Anyway, let's wait and see, Microsoft does not get into a market just to be second biggest (although sometimes that's all they get if not less), it has been like that with Internet Explorer, XboX, Windows, Office and the list just grows. Globally, they have done the excellent job of distributing their products in a way products worked and felt they were produced locally. The strategy works.

[greeneagle]

The GOOG has been working on "Localization" for a long time. "GOOGLE-Maps is just a side interest for what they have already done in their algs. Anyone serious about SEM has already made amends in client sites!

Ken

[luismorais]

Greeneagle,

Localisation here does not mean the use of maps as you pointed out. It has to do with adapting a system to a certain audience be it by translating it or using local metaphors to make it look and feel as natural as possible to a certain audience. It is an easy association, the one you made, but it is not the right one, I am afraid to say. Perhaps you are confused with the word 'location'.

Another definition of localisation.

For example, if we had to 'localise' your Mountain Eagle Marketing Service for a Latin-American audience, on top of translating it to Spanish, we would have to have discussions about the use of an Eagle in the logo since those are not native of all Latin American countries, we would also need to discuss how we would request users to make payments to you since people still prefer to use cheques over there and we would have to think about colours too.

Of course it takes more than that, this is just a little example to help you understand. Please re-read the article, there are some references on the interface Google and Yahoo uses in Latin America that will give you a clue of what localisation is as well.

Luis

[greeneagle]

Luis,

Go local for all local clients, period!

Or just don't worry about SEO or SEM trends at all!

Ken

[cspelts]

Somehow, I think greeneagle understands localization. <g>

[luismorais]

Hmm, my post is about Google's and Yahoo's interface and the title, I thought, was clear when it said International SE market and localisation, I really worked hard on the HSEO (Human Search Engine Optimisation)here to attract the right audience.

What I don't understand is how a discussion that had to do with how Google and Yahoo present their results and interface can produce comments on SEM practices on the professional side.

What I do in order to localise my sites is not the central point of the topic.

Actually localisation of sites is not the central point in my topic at all but how Google and Yahoo complicated the whole search process all over the Latin world with the 'Search the web' (which yelds results in English as well) selected by default whereas 'search Portuguese pages' and 'search Brazilian pages' are non-selected options.

If the topic is not relevant for the search engine discussion, I will be very happy to be assisted by one of the forum's moderators on what to do. Nevertheless the title was clear enough for anyone not interested in the subject keywords (MSN, international SE market and localisation) not to enter the thread and discuss something that is not the point of the subject.

I appreciate you have experience in localising sites and that is a normal occurrence in your professional practice. I did that for both Cisco Systems and Nortel Networks for years but as I said that was not the point of the topic.

As such I accept that you might not want to get into discussions that are about search trends, search engine interface or international markets and not get in there in first place. I agree with that, after all as someone established and with a successful business, you might want to either concentrate on the production of your own articles about subjects you judge relevant or simply ignore what you don't want to discuss thus saving your time to your own clients.

In that sense, you have my total understanding and support.

Luis

[ctabuk]

Surely what you are saying is more about 'Instant Identification with language and localisation to the the searcher?' In simplistic terms, if I were in Rio de Janeiro and I searched 'Ronald Biggs'on Google or Yahoo, you are requesting that a generic response from Google Brazil be found as opposed to a USA or other to be found? Well I just tried that search on Pesquisa Google paginas do Brasil, and I got Brazilian pages. Greeneagle was a Moderator here at WPW, and the reply he gave, I think covers the question asked, but please tell me if you need more, we are always happy to learn more.

[luismorais]

Originally Posted by ctabuk

Well I just tried that search on Pesquisa Google paginas do Brasil, and I got Brazilian pages.

Hi ctabuk,

That is exactly what I meant. A search in Google Brasil is by default (the 'all the web' option) a mixed search (both English and Portuguese) when from a Brazilian user point of view the default should be the option that yields Brazilian and Portuguese results only. Google Brasil is a localised 'Brazilian' search engine, as such the options for Results in Brazil or in Portuguese should be activated by default. As it is now one has to do what you did: select the language first.

The gap is not so noticeable when Google UK returns US pages in their results because the language is relatively the same.

Forcing foreign users to select their own language or geographical position when they are already in a localised version of a search engine is just adding an unnecessary step to the process of searching and giving margin to more confusion. It is like you had Google UK, defaulting all the search results to results from all over the EU first and then as options, asking UK users to select 'results in English only' or 'Results in the UK'. French, Italian and German can be as startling to UK users as English is to Brazilians and Latin-Americans in general.

One does not feel much of the difference in the UK search results because no matter what you select (all the web or pages in the UK) you will still get results in English. In the Latin-American case, one will get results in a language that is completely different from their own, in this case English.

In the Ronny Biggs example, leaving Google Brasil in the default, returns 2 top results in English. If a search is done with the word 'marketing', which is also used in the Portuguese language, most of the results will be in English by default. Once again, please take into consideration the hypothetical example I gave about Google UK returning EU results in all European languages and leaving results in English and from the UK as an option for you to select, that is how it feels for my population.

The solution could be quite simple: make the regional language and geographical location the default and add the options: 'results in other languages'. The minority of users who can speak English or other languages can have the extra work to get the pages outside their geographical and cultural reach and the majority of our population would have what they are looking for without much ado. That would close the circle around the localisation of these search engines in Latin America and make it perfect.

Many thanks in advance for your kind attention,

Luis

[ctabuk]

Ok, now the obvious thing to do is for me to do is to send this thread to both Google and Yahoo. I will do it with pleasure, in fact consider it done. But this surely is an educational thing for the SE's themselves to contemplate?

[luismorais]

Yes ctabuk, you're right it is an educational issue and apologies if somehow this thread was not relevant. I am deeply grateful for your initiative to send this thread to the big search engines.

Luis

[ctabuk]

Done, it is with Yahoo and Google

[luismorais]

Hi folks it has been almost 6 months since we last talked about this topic and a lot has changed since then. Basically:

- MSN in Latin-America decided to follow Google and Yahoo's way of serving results and now Portuguese in Brazil or Spanish in the rest of Latin America are not the default language served when a search is made...

- Japan, France and some other countries are starting to bite back for the same reasons I exposed in this post...

Article here

Merry Christmas for everyone,

Luis