Because DMOZ/ODP is not the only directory...

[minstrel]

I didn't even know about a couple of these:

- Yahoo
- DMOZ/ODP
- Zeal
- Gimpsy
- JoeAnt

Others?

[Sean]

www.Jayde.com
GoGuides.org
Websavvy.cc

Isedb.com has a nice list of directories and search engines.

[kayla22]

I find Atomicbot's directory to be one of the best.

http://www.atomicbot.com

[aaronmp2003]

Here is a question, though:

Is it worth your time to submit to these smaller directories? Without having the exact figures in front of me, I have heard that although there are many directories and search engines on the Internet, the majority of the traffic comes through the big players.

Anyone have an opinion on that? I run my own business, meaning I maintain the web site, the books, the customer data - the whole administrative shebang, plus actually doing the work - so I try to stay away from any Internet stuff that doesn't have a return on the time I invest in it.

Any opinions welcome!!

-- AP

[rocky1]

For the most comprehensive list of Search Engines and directories you'll find anywhere try ~

http://www.search-22.com/

Rocky

[janeth]

The directories are good because they count as a link back to your site.
So they also help you get ranked good on Google.

[Oman]

Aaron, you're right, the answer is no.

I'd never really looked closely at directories other than dmoz.org. So based upon this thread I did a little homework.

Each directory will offer you two options; (1)pay for expidited listing or (2) become a reviewer for the directory.

Another twist was found at zeal.com. Zeal has you take a 20 question quiz. The quiz is intended to bring you up to speed to meet the standards for submission to zeal. I bailed out halfway through the thing.

So to answer your question, no, I don't think the time invested is going to bring the returns that you're looking for.

Oman
Myfootshop.com

[rlrouse]

I prefer to spend my time getting regular links. The PR boost that you get from these small directories is no greater than that from a decent link from a regular site.

A little effort expended in the right areas can yield lots of good-quality unreciprocated links.

If a Directory wants me to pay or jump through hoops to get in, I can more effectively spend that money and time in more productive areas.

[minstrel]

I do agree with many of the posts in this thread - personally, if a directory is asking me to pay for a listing, my feeling is "why? it may benefit you but it is doubtful that it's going to benefit me - shouldn't you be paying me?".

On the other hand, for those smaller directories that do not demand payment for listing, why not submit? I agree that it may be difficult to determine how much you will benefit... But how can it harm you?

[wclew]

I agree with Minstrel, I don't feel that we should have to pay to be listed in a directory and I'm all for using the free directories as well. I hadn't thought about the point Janeth made about the links from the directories helping your relevance and in turn helping your Google ranking, that makes sense and it is all the more reason to use the free ones. Forgive me, but I'm going to be lazy and ask if anyone would mind listing any of these free directories that they have used besides the DMOZ.

[lawrence1]

This one isn't a directory, it's a new search engine
I came across the other day:

http://www.brainboost.com

It doesn't appear to have a way to get your site listed in it. Maybe one of you out there knows a way.

[le_gber]

The thing is that DMOZ is used by Google for its own directory and if you look closely at the google search engine results the description that you get on some site is the one you entered in DMOZ and it's now in the G directory. So if you had to choose only one directory, it would be DMOZ.

Then you have the big player that make you pay hundreds of dollars/pounds/euro and just guarantee to review your site - not even guarantee its listing. And I am sure that a lot of people here have paid the fee to include their professional site in at least one of these.

And finally you have the small ones, pfi or free, ok they are not as popular as the big player above, but as Janeth said, they provide backlinks. At the end of the day it depends how you feel about the directory. If it looks unprofessional and don't even allow bot to crawl, why bother? On the other end, if it looks pro, you have heard good review and know other professional who use it, why not pay the small fee in ten of them instead of the one big fee from the big players?

Leo

[rlrouse]

Janeth is correct. Inclusion in the smaller directories does provide a valuable backlink.

minstrel is correct as well: If submitting is free, how can it harm you? Well, it can't.

The reason I don't bother with them is I simply don't have time. I'm working on clients' linking campaigns every day, several at a time. The time that I would spend submitting each site to these small directories can be much more effectively used pursuing normal links, which, if done properly, count just as much and often more for rankings and traffic.

I used to submit every new client site to a few of these small directories, but I soon realized how much more I could accomplish on the clients' behalf by concentrating my efforts in other areas.

For someone with just one site or a small handful of sites to manage, submitting would indeed make sense because every link helps.

But when I have to manage my time effectively to provide the best results possible in a reasonable amount of time (and give the clients the best overall results for their money), I can no longer justify submitting to these smaller directories.

Of course DMOZ is a must. They aren't small and they do feed the Google Directory. Every site that I work on gets submitted there.

[webmaster36]

I do agree with the comments stated about dmoz but what can be done about their notoriously slow approach to listing your site? I have been waiting for 6 months now.

Even though I visited their discussion forum:-
http://www.resource-zone.com/postlis...rd=submissions

a month ago to check progress on my submmission (and was advised that my site is in the last 14 to be entered) I still see no sign of my site in their directory!

[minstrel]

Originally Posted by webmaster36

I do agree with the comments stated about dmoz but what can be done about their notoriously slow approach to listing your site? I have been waiting for 6 months now. Even though I visited their discussion forum a month ago to check progress on my submmission (and was advised that my site is in the last 14 to be entered) I still see no sign of my site in their directory!

Hi, webmaster36:

You're not alone - see this thread for more questions and some answers about DMOZ/ODP:
You down wit ODP? (Ya know me!)

[Duncan Pollock]

Well, I think it depends on what your business is and whether there are directories that either specialize in your kind of site or at least have a category that already contains many of your competitors.
In my neck of the woods -- which is real estate -- I consider myself fortunate. I've been able to submit to something like two dozen "collections of real estate websites" and I reckon it has to do me some good far more than prove to be a waste of time.
Into the bargain, it enables me to imply that I have a ranking in my profession. This is NOT the same as a PR figure with Google, but it possibly (or so I'm hoping) suggests that I've earned a "seal of approval" from people whose purpose it is to "recognize the players" -- even if those of us who've submitted to the lists have helped create them as a self-serving move (!).
I don't want to tout myself -- because how many WebProWorld members are likely to call me about finding them a house in my locality?!! -- but, if you wish, take a look at the cluster of logos at the end of my homepage ( http://www.duncanpollock.com ). I don't think it looks as though I count for nothing, does it? Moreover, there's no reason why you can't end up doing much the same yourself, is there?

Duncan

[cbp]

I do agree with the comments stated about dmoz but what can be done about their notoriously slow approach to listing your site? I have been waiting for 6 months now.

It is free service run by volunteers (with the inherent flaws that go with that). Would you rather pay the $300 that Yahoo charges for the same thing?

My advice to people is to submit and forget. DMOZ is only one link...

CBP

[mrdch]

Is it worth your time to submit to these smaller directories?

If it's traffic that you are after - I would say that it is marginal. Clearly the big traffic comes from the big guns, but there are other factors too:
- The traffic quality is different. If you are listed in the right directory at the right category, and someone found your site there - he/she are very likely to be an ideal visitor, from your site's perspective.
- If you are listed high in the SERP of Google etc. - you'll get massive amounst of traffic. Chances are, though, that few sites ARE listed that high. For the site listed after, say, the first 20 or 40 places - it is as if it is not listed at all. That is not quite the same with Directories, although that depends on the way they sort the search results and the entries in each category.

Each directory will offer you two options; (1)pay for expidited listing or (2) become a reviewer for the directory.

Not quite true. Some directories do offer a free submit option, like Gimpsy.

I'm going to be lazy and ask if anyone would mind listing any of these free directories that they have used besides the DMOZ.

For a full list see http://www.freewebsubmission.com and also the relevant entries in http://www.searchenginetrends.com

DMOZ is only one link

That is very true. The more links you have from good directories - the better the chances to do good at Google. It is a myth that a link at DMOZ has more weight. What is true, obviosuly, is that in order to appear in the Google directory - you must be listed at DMOZ - since Google simply gets the information from DMOZ.

Hope that helps :)

MC

[minstrel]

Originally Posted by mrdch

That is very true. The more links you have from good directories - the better the chances to do good at Google. It is a myth that a link at DMOZ has more weight. What is true, obviously, is that in order to appear in the Google directory - you must be listed at DMOZ - since Google simply gets the information from DMOZ.

I may be wrong here but I don't believe that's correct. Google certainly uses DMOZ/ODP as one of its sources but I don't think one HAS to be listed there to be listed in Google.

[mrdch]

I don't think one HAS to be listed there to be listed in Google

Indeed not, but I was referring explicitly to the Google directory. When you go to Google, you'll notice that one of the tabs says 'Directory'. If you check it out, you'll see that it is simp0ly a copy of DMOZ. :)

MC

[minstrel]

Originally Posted by mrdch

Indeed not, but I was referring explicitly to the Google directory. When you go to Google, you'll notice that one of the tabs says 'Directory'. If you check it out, you'll see that it is simply a copy of DMOZ.

Ok - thanks for the clarification - and you're certainly correct in that the Google directory is based on the DMOZ/ODP directory.

[wclew]

Thanks for the link to freewebsubmission.com mrdch, I've just used it. I must've got lucky because I just submitted 2 sites to the DMOZ about 2 weeks ago and have already got results on both.

[cbp]

I must've got lucky because I just submitted 2 sites to the DMOZ about 2 weeks ago and have already got results on both.

Its not unusal to get sites listed quickly - depends on the category and the quality of the submission (ie guidelines compliant) (2000-4000 get listed every day). Its just some categories are backlogged and some sites wait 6 months to a year - you always here about them, so its good to hear about yours.

In the small category I edit (after I cleared the backlog), I do not think any site waits more than 12 hours for me to list (usually) or reject (unusual).

CBP

[rlrouse]

CBP is exactly right. The timeliness of DMOZ's inclusions depend pretty much on the category that you submitted the site to and the individual editor who reviews the site. It could take days, months, or, in rare cases, forever (literally).

[alpine]

Here is the way I see it.

Re: Smaller Directories.

1. If I get a link back from this directory it will only be there for a short time most likely. Someone will either junp ahead of me with the next submission, or the directory will reorganize, or will sease to exist.

2. I will get solicited by this small directory to get a "top listing", but will not gt an accurate estimate on how many hits I will get for my money.

So the conclusion is, if the SEO client that I have has the time and the money to spend on trying to get business form the smaller directories, after listening to the con's above then fine, we will roll the dice.

I read my statistics very carefully, and mostly see YAHOO, MSN, and once in a blue moon altavista.

Now let's talk about highly specialized sites. For example someone that sells IVR equipment by part number to Russia. Then it would behoove them to list in the regional technical directories because that's the only place where people would look for that product. The part number may also come up in small directory as part of a larger search engine search

[mrdch]

Hi,

As with every generalization, there is the danger of throwing out the baby with the bath water. Not all 'small directories' are created equal :)

1. If I get a link back from this directory it will only be there for a short time most likely. Someone will either junp ahead of me with the next submission, or the directory will reorganize, or will sease to exist.

I am not sure on what basis can one claim the above. Sure, no one can predict the future, but why would a link 'be there for a short time'?? I cannot see how it may apply to Gimpsy, at any rate... The only time that a link is removed from Gimpsy is when a site is no longer accessible for a long time (dead link).

2. I will get solicited by this small directory to get a "top listing", but will not gt an accurate estimate on how many hits I will get for my money.

Again, a very gross generalization. At Gimpsy, you can see how many hits a site gets (or a position gets), going back 12 months, in addition to real time hits reporting. So, if you are in the Gimpsy directory it's very easy to find out if it's worthwhile for you to get a 'top listing' or not.

Hope that helps :)

MC

[cbp]

Quote:
1. If I get a link back from this directory it will only be there for a short time most likely. Someone will either junp ahead of me with the next submission, or the directory will reorganize, or will sease to exist.


I am not sure on what basis can one claim the above

Maybe there is some confusion here between a "small directory" and a "FFA that looks like a directory".

There is no reason to assume a small directory would drop you, but every reason to a FFA may after a while.

CBP

[mrdch]

There is no reason to assume a small directory would drop you, but every reason to a FFA may after a while.

Thanks for the clarification - that's quite right!

MC

[stoner3221]

In our advertising and submission campaign for Skaffe.com I submitted to thousands of directories world wide in what is still an ongoing campaign with many of the submissions still pending review. I’ve tracked the results carefully as well as the links from them in Google. It has proven to be beneficial and very helpful to us in achieving a PR of 4 in just 28 days and over 10,000 links to us in Google. It can be a frustrating task however since many of the small directories have long submission forms and after filling out the form and pressing the submit button you find it doesn’t work or comes up with an error page or worse yet takes you to an unannounced payment page. If you can stand many 16 hour days and poorly functioning sites you will find it’s beneficial in the long run.

[lrobertson]

www.kellysearch.com is a good directory as long as your website relates to either industry or manufacturing. It is free to have your site listed.

[awesomes]

Thank you lrobertson for the link to Kelly Search,
specific search engines are exactly what companies like ours need.
Just trudging through the mass of search engines available, is a chore in itself. Usually pleasant, but sometimes very frustrating.

[Mel]

Great thread and some good points have been made but no one seems to have remembered that as of the Florida update Google seems to be placing more ranking emphasis on expert or authority sites and links from them. many if not most directories qualify as expert sites.

I am of the opinion that links from directories will help your Google Rankings more than links from joes-diner.com

Another point to rememeber is that some directories (even those that you have to pay through the nose for a listing) will give you a javascript, cgi or tracking link which will not be counted as a link by google. Best to check them out before you bother.

One of the things that I find irritating is that many of the directories that suddenly find themselves ranking well for a competitive search term (Jewlery and real estate terms come to mind readily) are now charging (and getting) hundreds of dollars a month for listings.

Lets hope Google finds a way to fix that.