WebProWorld Part of WebProNews.com
Page One Link To Us Edit Profile Private Messages Archives FAQ RSS Feeds  
 

Go Back   WebProWorld > Search Engines > MSN Search Discussion Forum
Subscribe to the Newsletter FREE!


Register FAQ Members List Calendar Arcade Chatbox Mark Forums Read

MSN Search Discussion Forum Topics and discussions specific to MSN and/or Live Search. There is also a subforum for the discussion of Microsoft AdCenter.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 11-20-2006, 10:34 PM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453
Webnauts RepRank 3Webnauts RepRank 3
Default Optimizing Tips for MSN

Here you can find very useful tips for optimizing your web site for MSN.

1. With don't use your keywords more than 1 time in the description tag.

2. Try for an overall keyword wt. of the visible body text of less than 6%. Try to achieve minimum 3% where possible.

3. Don't use irrelevant META tags. Test them here.

4. Keywords in the domain name.

If possible, try to get a domain name which contain your keyword phrase. Or, it should contain your keyword phrase, and the keywords should be separated by hyphens (best option) or underscores.

To make sure that the engines recognize the keyword phrase, try to purchase domain names that separate each keyword with a hyphen (preferable) or an underscore. Most of the engines place added relevancy on keywords found in the domain name.

5. Consider naming this page after your keyword phrase.

Most of the engines place added relevancy on keywords found in the name of the page, or the URL. When naming your pages, try to name your pages after your keyword phrases.

6. Add your keyword phrase to a style attribute.

7. Consider naming your graphics with your keyword phrase and gaining a boost in relevancy that way.

8. MSN gives ranking honors to sites with an abundance of incoming links. And the good news is that MSN is counting a greater number of your incoming links toward ranking with the nit picking that Google and Yahoo! do. And that if those links have your keywords in them as anchor text, they help ranking for those keywords. You want to make sure that the page of the Website linking to you is in the MSN index and that it has a strong number of incoming to that domain as well as having less than 80 links on the page linking to you.

9. One Topic per page is recommended.

MSN Quote: "The best way to attract people to your site, and keep them coming back, is to design your pages with valuable content that your target audience is interested in.

In the visible page text, include words users might choose as search query terms to find the information on your site.

Limit all pages to a reasonable size. We recommend one topic per page.

An HTML page with no pictures should be under 150 KB," but lets not forget Google that would appreciate under 100KB

It's important that the sites linking to you are in the same Topic or "theme" area as your site. It doesn't have to be a product or service that is exactly the same as yours, a competitor.

For example if you sell web design, you can have anything related to web design services or serves other than actual web design. Of you can have news articles about web design that link to you.

If you are a Realtor you can have Realtors from other parts of the country linking to you, professional web design news sites, web developers, anything related to web design and development or to your region of the country if you are using keywords like "columbia web design".

10. Your linking strategy within your pages and your code can affect indexing and ranking.

MSN quote: "Use only well-formed HTML code in your pages. Ensure that all tags are closed, and that all links function properly.

If your site contains broken links, MSNBot may not be able to index your site effectively, and people may not be able to reach all of your pages....

Links embedded in menus, list boxes, and similar elements are not accessible to web crawlers unless they appear in your site map.

Keep the text that you want indexed outside of images. For example, if you want your company name or address to be indexed, make sure it is displayed on your page outside of a company logo.

MSNBot is the MSN Search web crawler that automatically crawls the Web to add information to our search index. MSNBot crawls the web by looking for links within websites.

So one of the best ways to ensure that MSNBot can find your website is to include valuable content that other sites will want to link to. While MSNBot crawls billions of web pages, not every page that we crawl is indexed.

For a site to be indexed, it must meet specific standards for content, design, and technical implementation.

For example, if your site’s link structure does not provide links to each page on your site, MSNBot may not be able to find all of your site’s pages.

Make sure that your site adheres to our design guidelines, which will help you place important content in searchable elements of the page.

Also ensure that your site does not violate any of the technical guidelines that can prevent appropriate ranking."

11. Meta Tag Description is important to MSN.

MSN recommends the following: "As the MSN Search web crawler MSNBot crawls your site, it analyzes the content on indexed pages and generates keywords to associate with each page.

Then MSNBot extracts page content that is highly relevant to the keywords (often sentence segments that contain keywords or information in the description) meta tag to construct the site description displayed in search results.

The page title and URL are also extracted and displayed in search results.

Site descriptions are extracted from the content of your page each time MSNBot crawls your site and indexes its pages. If you change the contents of a page, you may see a change in the description the next time our index is updated.

Since the descriptions are extracted from your indexed web pages, the best way to affect your site description is to ensure that your web pages effectively deliver the information you want to see in search results.

Excellent content design and effective use of terms that target your message are the best ways to affect the site description that MSNBot extracts from your site. Effective strategies include:

* Placing descriptive content near the top of each page.
* Making sure each page has a clear topic and purpose.
* Add a site description into the description meta tag, as shown here: <meta name="description" content="Describe your site here">".

Think about clickthroughs.

12. Content freshness is important at MSN.

13. In some cases it is recommended to use the Nofollow tag.

MSN, cooperating with Google and Yahoo! supports the nofollow tag. It was originally implemented so blogs aren't used for spamming by having links in their comments section.

However, there are other uses to help your optimization. For one, you can focus your PageRank on particular pages within your site so you don't waste PageRank on pages that aren't important for ranking. Add the tag to all the links that point to pages that are not important for ranking and traffic generation.

Another use is to keep a link from going out to another site and giving away PageRank to other sites, or referring to a site that you don't necessarily need to be helping with their popularity.

Don't use this with your reciprocal linking partners and make sure your partners aren't sneaking it into their links that go to you.

14. Use an XML site map as we do already for Google and Yahoo.
By the way, since some days now, all major search engines Google, Yahoo and MSN are using a unique XML site map.

15. MSN gives Site Owners suggestions for optimization gives all the relevant information for optimizing a site and getting it indexed with MSN.

Happy optimizing for MSN! :)
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2006, 11:10 AM
brian.mark's Avatar
brian.mark brian.mark is offline
Administrator
 

Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Omaha
Posts: 2,717
brian.mark RepRank 2brian.mark RepRank 2
Default

One of the tips there that I have a problem with is "Use your keywords in your domain". If that's the case, just for 1/3 of our conversions we'd need 500 domains.

Keyword rich domains are a luxury, not a necessity. If you've got that specific of a niche, it may work out. But look at a search for seo. Result #4 is seochat, the first 3 don't have SEO in the domain at all.

A-typical you say? Try air tools and see that airtools.com is #6, which is below ToolBarn.

Ok, one more try. The phrase power tools gives us 1 in the top 10 with that phrase in the domain.

Understanding that it takes 1000's and 1000's of phrases to make up a successful online business means you'd have to have 1000's and 1000's of domains, which I just don't buy.

Otherwise, there's some solid advice for anyone starting out in this field to follow.

Brian.
__________________
ToolBarn.com, an Internet Retailer Top 500 and Inc. 500 Company | Tool Parts | Pet Supplies
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 11-22-2006, 05:27 AM
ctabuk's Avatar
ctabuk ctabuk is online now
Moderator
WebProWorld Moderator
 

Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lincolnshire
Posts: 3,975
ctabuk RepRank 3ctabuk RepRank 3ctabuk RepRank 3
Default

Brian Mark Wrote #One of the tips there that I have a problem with is "Use your keywords in your domain". If that's the case, just for 1/3 of our conversions we'd need 500 domains.#
Use a long lead html code

Ie optimize the site for the keyword so that it reads

www.mysite. com/co.uk/org etc /keyword-pagetitle.html

Use Directory feeds where you have submitted those pagetitles/keywords so that they point to your page.
__________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8UMm-eSLD0 We have a record Company Interested!!!! http://newhistoricalfictionbooks.blogspot.com/
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 11-23-2006, 09:21 AM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453
Webnauts RepRank 3Webnauts RepRank 3
Default

OK gentlemen. I updated that part of my post. How does it look like now?
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2006, 01:23 PM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453
Webnauts RepRank 3Webnauts RepRank 3
Default

Well it looks like my tips had a grade of 14.5 out of 15?
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2006, 01:40 PM
incrediblehelp's Avatar
incrediblehelp incrediblehelp is offline
Moderator
WebProWorld Moderator
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Live in Cincy Now
Posts: 7,123
incrediblehelp RepRank 4incrediblehelp RepRank 4incrediblehelp RepRank 4incrediblehelp RepRank 4
Default

Just to be clear, lots of these recommendations work great for all SE's are not purely for MSN.

Also I still haven't bought into the no follow tag stuff. just see to many times where spiders still follow a link with this tag attribute being used.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2006, 02:13 PM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453
Webnauts RepRank 3Webnauts RepRank 3
Default

You got it Incrediblehelp! :) Great post!
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 11:12 PM
crush123 crush123 is offline
WebProWorld Pro
 

Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 218
crush123 RepRank 0
Default

thanks for this great post.
the information is very helpful.

however, i have seen many sites in msn with top ranks that have no description or keyword meta tags.
i think these tags may not be so important for msn.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 12-12-2006, 10:06 AM
ctabuk's Avatar
ctabuk ctabuk is online now
Moderator
WebProWorld Moderator
 

Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lincolnshire
Posts: 3,975
ctabuk RepRank 3ctabuk RepRank 3ctabuk RepRank 3
Default

It still pays to have them though.
__________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8UMm-eSLD0 We have a record Company Interested!!!! http://newhistoricalfictionbooks.blogspot.com/
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2006, 10:44 PM
jenteh jenteh is offline
WebProWorld New Member
 

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Kuala Lumpur
Posts: 10
jenteh RepRank 0
Default

Thanks for these great tips on MSN!

My site May's House of Beauty is short on traffic, can everyone help me to push up the traffic, please?! Thank you! Thank you!

Here is wishing everyone Merry Christmas & Happy New Year!
__________________
Jennifer
May's House of Beauty
http://www.maysbeautyhouse.com
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2006, 11:11 PM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453
Webnauts RepRank 3Webnauts RepRank 3
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jenteh
Thanks for these great tips on MSN!

My site May's House of Beauty is short on traffic, can everyone help me to push up the traffic, please?! Thank you! Thank you!

Here is wishing everyone Merry Christmas & Happy New Year!
If you need help, start a new thread. Here you can only make comments or suggestions above the tips above.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 01-06-2007, 10:51 PM
littlegiant littlegiant is offline
WebProWorld Pro
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 157
littlegiant RepRank 0
Default

Add your keyword phrase to a style attribute?

I've never heard of this before (and I consider myself quite experienced in CSS). Can you give me an example?
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 01-08-2007, 09:58 AM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453
Webnauts RepRank 3Webnauts RepRank 3
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by littlegiant
Add your keyword phrase to a style attribute?

I've never heard of this before (and I consider myself quite experienced in CSS). Can you give me an example?
Classes and ids. But do that with care.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 01-08-2007, 03:32 PM
incrediblehelp's Avatar
incrediblehelp incrediblehelp is offline
Moderator
WebProWorld Moderator
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Live in Cincy Now
Posts: 7,123
incrediblehelp RepRank 4incrediblehelp RepRank 4incrediblehelp RepRank 4incrediblehelp RepRank 4
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by littlegiant
Add your keyword phrase to a style attribute?
This doesn't work. I would only be as descriptive as necessary here, just like ALT tags. Don't spam in here.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 01-08-2007, 03:41 PM
littlegiant littlegiant is offline
WebProWorld Pro
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 157
littlegiant RepRank 0
Default

That's my impression as well, incrediblehelp. I've never heard of anybody using this method before let alone proving it successful.
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 01-09-2007, 08:33 AM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453
Webnauts RepRank 3Webnauts RepRank 3
Default

Incrediblehelp and Littlegiant I got a newsletter today from Axandra.com and they mention there:

Quote:
"Search engines don't want to be fooled by webmasters. For that reason, they started to index CSS files. If search engines find anything that looks like spamming in a CSS file, they might penalize the corresponding site."
They did not provide any source to back that up though.

But logically and technically, I personally cannot see any problem that CSS files can be crawled and viewed by search engines.

And now my question to you both, to make sure if you are right:

If I have somewhere this piece of code, one or more times in my html document <span class="webnauts">seo,search,engine,optimization,sm o,sem,accessibility,usability,training</div>

and in my external stylesheets #webnauts {display: none} or #webnauts {visibility: none}

am I not in danger to get penalized? If not, that is an excellent idea to have hidden text with my keywords in my pages.

But isn't that pre-historic black hat SEO already?

Well, I think you both know too much about these issues, so I hope you can help me out with that. :)
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 01-09-2007, 08:58 AM
littlegiant littlegiant is offline
WebProWorld Pro
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 157
littlegiant RepRank 0
Default

Webnauts,

I'm not sure I get your point but what you describe there is definitely classic black hat SEO.

What I was referring to though is your suggestion to use keywords in class names and id names. Is there any proof that that works?
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 01-09-2007, 09:29 AM
Webnauts's Avatar
Webnauts Webnauts is offline
WebProWorld 1,000+ Club
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 6,453