Quixstar Any one heard of it?

dmcgill · #1 (**permalink**) 08-14-2003, 02:50 PM

Hi,

I have joined up to a company called quixtar. They are located at www.quixtar.com I am looking for downlines but the main question is have you heard of them before. Some of my friends, (who signed me up) are making up to 10,000 per month now and really not working hard at all. I was thinking of doing my own store online.
Comments please
dmcgill

antkneetag · #2 (**permalink**) 08-14-2003, 03:08 PM

Quixtar is Amway Online. I know some people that have been stuggling since the begining to make it pay off. Keep in mind, I live in a small town and alot of people here are very skeptical of the MLM.

I personally have been involved, but I have very little ambition to do face to face hard sell. So, I failed at it.

Also, downline (as with any MLM) is key and so is your willingness to pay high prices for day to day items to keep your volume up.

Quote:

Some of my friends, (who signed me up) are making up to 10,000 per month now and really not working hard at all.

How much did your friends spend to achieve that level? What is the net profit?

Now, I am not against the MLM by any means. I have been involved in probably 10 legit ones (Quixtar being the last). I know that a lot of people have become very weathly with downline help. It just isn't for me.

Just some things to think about, I wish you success in your new venture.

#3 (**permalink**) 08-14-2003, 03:27 PM

What my friends have been successful in doing is:
Use it with non-profit, charitable organizations as a fund raiser. They have gone to the boards, and made one an IBO then that IBO makes other members of the board their downlines etc.

They are selling what people buy everyday, tp, food, snacks and coffee, laundry detergent etc. They all buy the products and make the non-profit organization make some fund raisers. In the process, they get their kick back. It seems to be working and I live in a small area too but there sure seems to be a lot of amway soap and cleaning supplies (empty's) at the curb on garbage day!. Must be working.
Dmcgill

SyrenSong · #4 (**permalink**) 08-15-2003, 04:05 PM

Personally, I'd steer clear of it.

I'll admit I like some of Amway's products, like their soap and drain cleaner, but Quxitar smelled bad when it was pitched to me. And that was before I knew it was Amway online.

My sister was in Amway for several years. She worked her heart out and got next to nowhere. Most of the folks that earn really big money have been at this for quite a few years now. I honestly don't believe there's any real money left in the program for the little guy now, or folks just getting started in the company.

Yes, I've seen the fancy cars, and houses - my sister's got pictures of herself standing next to several of them. But from what she's told me, those wonderful things all belong to folks who've been in the program for 15-20+ years.

I've yet to hear a recent success story. Someone who's been in the program for less than 5+ years who's been able to make it a full-time job needing nothing else to supplement their income. I won't even mention not hearing of anyone who's been able to buy a Rolls Silver Cloud who hasn't been selling the company and its products for less than 15+ years.

It just doesn't make good business sense to me. If you can't find folks come in under you and work at least as hard as you do at selling products and recruitment, then you don't stand a chance of getting ahead.

I repeat original statement - I'd steer clear of it.

HTH!
Syren

dmcgill · #5 (**permalink**) 08-15-2003, 04:29 PM

Thanks for the advice... I am wilted now and in need of water but honesty is what I am looking for.
I have created several mlm websites for customers and have never heard of a site making it. I am going to try and push their coffee for a while and see what happens but I won't get my hopes up about getting rich too soon. Again, thanks for your honesty. I needed that!!
dcmgill

ojo4max · #6 (**permalink**) 08-15-2003, 05:03 PM

As always, you get what you pay for. You are better off doing your own site than paying someone to do it for you, especially since you are going to do the work anyway. Just my 10 cents. Good luck to you.

design@divergentweb.com · #7 (**permalink**) 08-15-2003, 07:18 PM

FROM A FORMER QUIXTAR MEMBER - EVALUATED BECOMING AN IBO FOR ABOUT A YEAR UNDER MY POTENTIAL UPLINE

Let's start with my short story: I met a great person who tried to sell me on Quixtar/Amway. In the end we are still friends, I never became an IBO, and he quit after several years although he started with them before the launch of Quixtar.com when they were only Amway. Below are 2 Internet References, and the "DETAILS" section is what I learned first hand and from research.

INTERNET REFERENCES:
Good Links From DMOZ:
http://dmoz.org/Business/Opportuniti...y_and_Quixtar/

Good Links From Google (many shared with above):
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...xtar+nightmare

DETAILS
Some major problems with Quixtar:

1) TIME AND MONEY: Although the presentation they gave me was basically make good money, have loads of family time, and retire with good income, I found out that you actually need to sacrifice lots of time to make it to the point where you have enough downlines to be successful. Also your downlines have to have downlines that have downlines that have downlines - which insures that you don't lose your immediate downlines since they would quit if they are not successful ;)

2) TRAIN TRAIN TRAIN: It gets worse. Once you have a good pyramid building downline, you still need to host and train your downlines (if you want them to be successful, which you do!) until they get to the point where you (at this point) would be aiming for - and that is giving speeches at Quixtar Training seminars to make the really big bucks! If you ever think you are going to have MAJOR free time like a millionaire should, think again! For your downlines to be successful and to increase your income you have regular meetings at your house - or a downline's house - where you might do training or try to follow up on contacts. The wives meet, etc, its all nice, but you must continue to do this. Where is the free time?

3) TRAINING TOOLS - BUY BUY BUY: If you have not already been told, many or all of the tapes you have been given for FREE cost money to your upline, and these tapes are these IBO's who have "made it" and are being paid big bucks to speak at Quixtar Training Seminars (as mentioned in #2 above). You will find that your upline expects you to start buying these tapes, and other training tools down the road. To take this into the future, you must also push all of your downlines to buy these training materials from you on a regular basis also (more on this below if you're not bored already;) )

4) STAY AWAY! That's what you are told. If people do not fit your profile (that is, want to do 'the business') you are told to stay away since they are "normal people" that don't "have dreams" and they will hold you back! You do not have to listen, but you will be pushed over and over to sever non-income producing ties, or even family ties that are negative (like your Mom wants you to "get away from those Amway people").

5) SPEAK SPEAK SPEAK: When you "make it" you will have downlines who are holding their own training meetings at their house, so you are freed up. Even better is when your downlines get to the point where their downlines have reached this point. Even now, you have unhappy tasks such as making sure you are still selling those tools to your downlines and making sure they attend those Quixtar Training Seminars - that they have to pay to get into. Oh, I have not mentioned that yet. For the speakers to get paid well, someone has to pay. The IBO's attending the seminars pay. You had better have your downlines attending these seminars by now, and you had better attend them as well! At this point you'd be saying - where is all of my "free time" - that is what I was promised.

I decided to "try it out" with my IBO for a long time, he let me 'hang in' for a year because I was going to join, I just had to get more info and be totally sure. I signed up as a member on the Quixtar.com website and bought some (slightly more expensive) products that I could afford. In the end when he met with me, his wife and my wife, it was my wife who saved me, she said flat out said "No". Since the deal was "spend more time with your family" and "you'd get to work with your wife" and "oh, your wife is really expected to host the other wives, not really sell as much as you do", this sunk the deal. I backed off and looked at Quixtar, finally finding some nightmare stories posted on the net. A former downline of my upline (would have been a brother IBO to me if I joined) sent me these URL's, and it was worse than I ever thought it could be.

MY OPINION: If you don't mind an organization making promises that can't be kept, a company that forces you to turn your personal life into a business life, a business where you sell a mixture of things that are needed and things that are bought solely to make good income for your upline, a business that I feel really pushes you to push other people to do things that are not so great - then you are set. If you have a conscience, (again my opinion, it will either wither away, or it will force you to leave Quixtar.

rcbtmc2003 · #8 (**permalink**) 08-15-2003, 10:35 PM

D McGill,

First off congrats to you for taking the step into the wide
world of network marketing.

Now take a good look at that word "network marketing"
Network in this case will mean a group of like minded
individuals,(at the minimum) And marketing will be YOUR way
of generating leads for your products and business.

The "marketing" part is where most folks get lost. You are
running a business which can provide with the things you
want in your life as long as you learn the proper ways of
marketing. These ways are not through the tape of the month
that is being pushed by your upline nor are they the junk
that is spread over the net like FFA's, classified ads,
click for view programs, etc.

Marketing is the way you are going to generate leads for
your business online and off.

I am a little confused on your statement:

"...I am looking for downlines..." ????

These you will hand build yourself with the people you
choose to work with, train and support.

Don't be too surprised if you yourself do not receive these
things from your upline...they are rare.

Hindsight is always 20/20 however to market any MLM or
network marketing company without getting into a long
laundry list of what to look for (Matt Gagnon does a great
job of this at http://direct-networking.net ) there are 2
things you need:

1. A unique and consumable product that people WANT :)

Want is the key. We all buy with emotion and justify later
with logic.

It must be unique and preferably patented or protected in
some way so that people must come to you to get it.

Consumable so that people buy constantly. This is not
limited to just products that are taken in the body.
Anything that is used up on a regular basis is consumed.

2. A marketing system that consistently generates you fresh
prospects and is something that a new business builder can
learn easily, effectively and quickly.

This system will consist of lead generation tools and
products that you create for you and your team. (Maybe you
were fortunate to get on a team that has a step by step plug
in system already...however as I said before the higher ups
usually talk a bunch of hype to get people excited and then
leave em hanging...

You never, ever, ever want to lead with your full blown
pitch on your opportunity. Qualify people. Have them
request information. Preferably purchase a small lead in
product.

The best thing is to create some type of information product
based on how YOU will teach, train and support those that
become involved with you and what exactly you expect in
return.

Remember you are not running a charity, you are running a
business.

Don't be intimidated about creating a free report or e-
course.

One of the easiest to create even if you hate to write is a
resource report. Find a problem that your products or
business solve and then put together a list of online
resources that prospects can view that are related to this
problem. Just put in the link and maybe a sentence or two
of a mini review of why you included it.

Another way is to have someone else create it for you. You
can post a project at http://www.elance.com and pay someone
to design something for you.

Online your success is not based on buying the tape of the
month or jumping on the monthly program that supports your
upline however doesn't convert customers.

Success is based on a constant supply of qualified traffic
that converts into sales for you.

Feel free to PM me if I can be of any help to you.

Again best of success....

Rodney Boettger

JC_NOVELTY · #9 (**permalink**) 08-15-2003, 10:59 PM

Just a quick note... I too joined Quixtar a couple of months back. I was approached by a good friend's husband who has quit work and gone on his own. These are "every day normal people" whom I have known 20+ years and I thoroughly thought they had something. I currently own my own web store, and had planned on including some of the Quixtar products and fundraising ideas in with my other business.
As it turns out, the "profit" isn't what it seemed, and it will cost me more to sell the products than I can realistically expect to get on my return.
The only thing this is good for is making money from yourself. Purchase products at inflated prices for your own home, and receive a kick back for doing so.
I think it's easier to go to Walmart and get the sale price!

acornwebworks · #10 (**permalink**) 08-16-2003, 11:31 AM

With advance apologies as needed, when I read your original post, I immediately thought "This is someone using the forum to get people in his downline by acting like a newbie and posting his ad as a question. " That was in particular because you wrote "Some of my friends, (who signed me up) are making up to 10,000 per month now and really not working hard at all."

You provided timely responses, which got me thinking that maybe your posting was a non-ad after all and you seriously believed this stuff...even though the statement that not 'one' of your friends, but 'some' of your friends were making huge amounts of money for little effort kept my 'skeptical genes' on full alert.

Then I read your response about how these friends are doing it:

"What my friends have been successful in doing is: Use it with non-profit, charitable organizations as a fund raiser. They have gone to the boards, and made one an IBO then that IBO makes other members of the board their downlines etc.

They are selling what people buy everyday, tp, food, snacks and coffee, laundry detergent etc. They all buy the products and make the non-profit organization make some fund raisers. In the process, they get their kick back."

Well, I took early retirement a couple of years ago to take a pay cut and work for a non-profit. I'm also on the boards of several other non-profits and actively involved in fundraising. And I haven't met a board yet that would participate actively enough in this kind of effort to generate $10,000 a month in commissions for even one your friends, much less several.

As I've done before in prior postings, I did the math, this time using data from Quixtar Amway Business Analysis < http://amquix.50megs.com/amway.html >

Direct quotes:

1) "An IBO selling 7,500PV or about $17,000 a month of core products to loyal customers at retail prices could gross almost $100,000/year"

2) "Member purchases generate only half the bonus points and no retail markup. A customer paying retail prices can be over three times as profitable as a Member."

3) "In order to attract the most participants, many groups teach their prospects to just change their shopping habits and purchase $200-$250/month of products from their "own business". Since "selling" turns many people off, many groups teach their prospects to simply "redirect their buying power" and "buy from themselves". They should then teach others to do the same.

4) "Quixtar paid IBOs an average of 28% of sales in 2000 and 2001. Each IBO buying $200 per month would generate gross commissions of just $675 per year despite possible annual expenses of $2,000 or more."
5) "Average IBO income can only be increased by increasing personal sales, not by recruiting more IBOs."

**

Here's what these mean.

A) Your friends (and I'm going to assume a collective where they get the $10,00 a month combined) would need to be selling $17,000 a month retail to gross almost $100,000. (See 1) - or an average of $8,333 a month.

B) If all these board members are in the downline, then they are not buying retail...which is 3 times more profitable (See 2) - if this is the case, your friends would need to be selling $51,000 a month

C) Your description of what your friends are doing implies that the board members in the downline are buying the products. Assuming the $200-250 figure in 3), to get $17,000 a month in sales, they would need 68-85 people a month buying the product. To get to $51,000 a month, it would be 204 - 255 people.

The average non-profit board is between 9-15 people. At the very least, using these figures, your friends would need 5 boards where every single member purchases Amway. At most, they'd need 29. And this is assuming that every single board member purchases in these amounts...not a likely assumption. An alternative is that some board members are extremely successful in selling Amway month after month after month...and give the profits away?? (The agency has to make their money somehow.)

So I remain highly skeptical that your friends are making this kind of money using these kinds of tactics...*while doing very little work*. And that's the sticking point for me...just like it was when I read your first posting.

By the way, you wrote "I live in a small area too but there sure seems to be a lot of amway soap and cleaning supplies (empty's) at the curb on garbage day!." If that's the case, then you have to consider that your market area may be already saturated. So how are *you* going to make money when someone is already successfully selling in your area and has scooped up all those customers?

Take care,
Kendall

lorilee · #11 (**permalink**) 08-16-2003, 12:12 PM

I signed up with them and it was a big mistake. It all sounds good when they talk to you and show you the potential but it's up to you to build your downline and without people ready to sign up, you won't make it.

This happens with most of these pyramid plans. I had people interested but when it came down to getting the money to get an account of their own and them going out to find people to sign up under them....well.

Needless to say, the whole ordeal was a waste for me so my suggestion to you is to take it slow with them because if your planning to do email campaigning you have to do it their way or they won't let you do it. Their corporate attorneys don't want spam suits.

I have 2 online stores and this was going to be the one to put me over the top so that I would have to do nothing but sit all day.

ackerley1 · #12 (**permalink**) 08-16-2003, 02:02 PM

My wife and I were coaxed into Quixtar about a year for a week. Foolishly we signed up and then did all the math. This is what we learned.

Before signing up we went to several functions and house meetings (free since we weren't IBO's) spent 2 nights a week for a month on these meetings. So in addition to these 2 nights a week we were supposed to show the plan 3-5 times a week, and we try to have a date night each weeek and a relax sit in our pj's and do nothing day. That makes 7 to 9 days a week which obviously does not offer much free time when you tack that on to an 8 to 12 hour work day. So the free time is there once you get the large group of IBO's and customers.

Another thing is when you actually look how you get paid according to the plan it is quite facinating. You buy the things you need at retail prices, pretend you bought them at wholesale and save the difference as profit. That is how they make the numbers look so lucrative. If I can recall, in the first two pay structure diagrams, I think between 70 and 90 percent of your 'profit' was done by doing this.

After we got out, my wife and i did an experiment. (understand we only do one major grocery shop a month and then staples like milk and eggs and fruit etc we go when needed) We also buy everything in generic labels. Except things like Coke and Heinz ketchup everything else is generic. In quixtar, everything is name brand and thus you obviously pay for that. anyhow, we went for our normal grocery shop and wrote down the price we paid for the generic and the price of the comparable name brand product. For $250 grocery shop buying generic products, we could have spent nearly $350 had we bought name brands. So we put that $92 dollar differnce in the bank as 'profit'. Therefore functioning similar to the early stages of quixtar and saving is 5 to 7 days a week of 'building the business'

One last thing to add, is that the real money is in the tapes and seminars (or pep rallies). Once you bust your ass and spend several thousands of dollars several times over, then you get to that point were you start making money off tapes and seminars. In the tapes and seminars we listened to, not one of them had been in the business less that 18 years. Never heard stories of people less than 5 years in the business making more than 2 to 3 thousand a month (Which I confess is not bad, but at the expense of what?).

Oh yeah, final point. does anyone tell you its Amway? Trying to say amway to people and they probably won't let you in the door. "But quixtar is not amway" is what they all say. "A rose by any other name is still a rose." Same company, same pressure tactics, same false promises, different name.

Hope this helps in your choice.

Rob

jvn · #13 (**permalink**) 08-16-2003, 02:24 PM

I was first introduced to MLM thru Amway before the change to Quixtar. The concept is sound, but like many who have already stated, the #'s just make it difficult to make any serious money. I opted out of Amway after about 3 years.
As for the "pressure tactics" we could start an entire topic on this alone. NO matter what MLM business you are developing, it is critical to weigh the opportunity like an business owner. This includes who you partner with. If pressure tactics is not the way you want to work your business, then stay away from those associates. If the business is sound but the associates are not the type you want for a long term working relationship, then search for or develop a new "style". As with any business involving people, there is potential for both good and bad apples.

jimcasey008 · #14 (**permalink**) 08-16-2003, 08:54 PM

If you study the sociology of cults, you will find the avenue to success (and failure)in MLM.
Here are 11 observations from my own 2 experiences with MLM and research into cults in Graduate School:
1)There is only one party line and all must follow. 2)Git rid fo skeptical friends.
3)Associate as often as possible with the true believers.
4)Give your dollar support to the group till it hurts.
5)Become a missionary for your new creed.
6)In first contacts, don't tell targets of your real purpose.
7)Rely on the target's need for group association or human frailty (greed?)
8)Involve the entire family or separate from the family to join the larger loving group of like minded souls.
9)Seek out, befriend and bring into the fold, those who are likely to want to become missionaries of the cause.
10)Never share a loss of confidence or belief with those in authority (up line)
11)Never view those who fail in any other terms than "they just didn't work at it hard enough."

I am sure others of you may have similar observations.
Jim Casey

jimcasey008 · #15 (**permalink**) 08-16-2003, 09:03 PM

If you study the sociology of cults, you will find the avenue to success (and failure)in MLM.
Here are 11 observations from my own 2 experiences with MLM and research into cults in Graduate School:
1)There is only one party line and all must follow. 2)Git rid fo skeptical friends.
3)Associate as often as possible with the true believers.
4)Give your dollar support to the group till it hurts.
5)Become a missionary for your new creed.
6)In first contacts, don't tell targets of your real purpose.
7)Rely on the target's need for group association or human frailty (greed?)
8)Involve the entire family or separate from the family to join the larger loving group of like minded souls.
9)Seek out, befriend and bring into the fold, those who are likely to want to become missionaries of the cause.
10)Never share a loss of confidence or belief with those in authority (up line)
11)Never view those who fail in any other terms than "they just didn't work at it hard enough."

I am sure others of you may have similar observations.
Jim Casey

jvn · #16 (**permalink**) 08-16-2003, 09:57 PM

Jim,

I disagree with your equation "Post subject: Qxstar=MLM=Cult" that all MLM are cults. Insurance companies, realtors, mortgage brokers, and even many web hosting companies use the format. MLM is simply a marketing method rewarding those who promote the company and turn that promotion into sales. If we were talking about an insurance company marketing plan, we would need to differentiate between the way some individuals within a company market vs how others within the same company market.
The bottom line questions shoud be:

"Is the marketing plan sound?"
"Are the people I'm working with credible?"
"Is the product or service of good value?"

Your analogy of the sociology of cults is great. That sums up much of the "bad apples" approach to MLM.

Just my opinions - for what its worth :)