Name Your Favorite Browser

[SyrenSong]

I'm curious about what browsers people prefer to use and why.

As a web designer, I think it's very important to design for multiple browsers. Sometimes people choose their browser because of a disability. Sometimes it's the browser that came with preloaded on their computer. Sometimes it was downloaded for one or more very specific reasons.

Oh, and if you have a specific version you prefer, I'd like to know why that version is better than the others.

So, what's your browser and why? An interested designer wants to know!

Looking forward to hearing from you.
Syren

[SyrenSong]

Ooops! I forgot to add Opera. My apologies to all the Opera users out there! ;)

Syren

[TheWebDoctor(tm)]

There are tons more browsers out there than the top dogs everyone knows about.

IBM HomePage Reader is low cost and performs well.

Windows Platform: K-Meleon

Cross-Platform: Firebird, Beonex, Pheonix

Mac Platform: Camino

*nix Platforms: Aphrodite, Galeon

IBM Web Browser for OS/2

There are tons more. http://browsers.evolt.org/ and http://dir.yahoo.com/Computers_and_I..._web/browsers/.

But I know Syren listed only a few to be brief.

My personal favorite is Firebird for its small load and footprint on my system resources. Plus the ability to support the other languages IE doesn't even come close to supporting. But knowing I have to support IE in my designs I limit the advancements in some sites.

[PBITech]

Opera 7.11.....Thanks :)

Jim

[jScott_Harris]

I'm not picky on my fav, but I'm picky on what it supports. I'm a huge fan of PNG's. They do things other formats only dream about. So it sucks that IE doesn't support their transparency features. Opera does probably the best job i've seen for Windows, and I've never seen a problem on any Linux browser. (But really, who wants to design on linux? GIMP sux!)

[SyrenSong]

Originally Posted by TheWebDoctor

But I know Syren listed only a few to be brief.

Yeah. I really hated to pick and choose. Especially since I knew I was going to leave out quite a few that are more popular with designers than with the average web surfer, but I had to start somewhere.

***********

Originally Posted by jScott_Harris

I'm not picky on my fav, but I'm picky on what it supports. I'm a huge fan of PNG's. They do things other formats only dream about.

You're right about PNG files. But since I try to program for older browsers, as well as newer ones, I try to avoid using PNGs, in spite of all their promise and what the future holds. ;)

One of my favorite features for Mozilla and Opera is the ability to disable popups! But Google's toolbar is only available for IE, so far (and several other toolbars as well).

As for Opera, I've seen a few problems with some Opera versions and lack of support for iframes. That causes problems for some sites I've visited. I don't know if the problem extends to Linux, though. Have you noticed anything like that?


**********

Thanks for your responses so far, folks. I really appreciate the input!

Syren

[J_Paul]

I'd have to say that my fav is probably IE, not because I use it all the time, but because most of the population of the internet uses IE as a default. For me it's about designing for the most popular browers, so IE tops the chart aye?

All your browser are belong to us

[SyrenSong]

Originally Posted by J_Paul

I'd have to say that my fav is probably IE, not because I use it all the time, but because most of the population of the internet uses IE as a default. For me it's about designing for the most popular browers, so IE tops the chart aye?

Yeah. IE tops the charts, but how do you deal with other browsers? Do you test at all for compatibility? Or are folks using other browsers left totally on their own?

I've had sites crash my entire computer to the point of needing a complete restart, simply because I'm not using IE.

Just because IE comes with the Windows software, it doesn't mean you have to use it. Any more than you've got to keep using the same tires that came with your car originally, even though you know there are better brands out there.

Along the same lines, why else would auto detailing shops and the J.C. Whitney catalog be so popular? ;)

Syren

[J_Paul]

Syren,

I usually test in Netscape and IE and things tend to work in the other browsers as well from there.

I suppose over the years I have learned to minimize my coding so that it will show properly in each browser without problems. I occasionally have some huge problems here and there that I have to work out. But it's most works.

[TheWebDoctor(tm)]

Well for those IE fans out there, let me point you to this article http://www.okec.org/news/standards.htm. I'm not pointing it out simply because I was interviewed by this State organization, but more so that it will point out views from others.

IE offers nothing, at this point, on the Windows platform. The only thing it offers is a thorn in the side of visitors who choose better software.

I've gone on record stating that I will not be a patron of businesses that develop for IE only. I also do not recommend the services of those companies.

Now for the exciting news. IE is not tops. Let me explain some things that people simply do not pay total attention to.

There are tons of browsers out there. Of those browsers many of them mask themselves as IE so that those poorly written scripts will work in their browsers. Take as an example Opera. Take again the example of JAWS and IBM HomePage Reader.

Those are three top of the line browsers and assistive technologies that can or do mask themselves as IE. While JAWS is based upon the IE engine, it is not IE.

AOL is returning to the IE engine. However, it is not IE.

Therefore, it is easy to see that there isn't anything that developing for IE which provides importance or demands for developing for that browser.

When a person states that IE is the #1 used browser I end up defeating that argument because they can't prove it's IE visiting their site. The only show server logs where the visitor used a program that identified itself as IE.

Now, for the really cool part of this and an even more or less surprising piece of work. Many of the email harvesters use the IE mask so that they can get by the blocks or redirects that would otherwise prevent them from capturing email addresses off a site.

Seems a one-sided, shorted vision of something that people just don't understand. Even the top of the line logging tools like WebTrends can't tell the difference.

At any rate, I hope those that read the article appreciate it.

[SyrenSong]

Hey WebDoctor -

I had heard of email harvesters (and occasionally some search engines, depending on the analysis software used, or so I've been told) posing as other browsers, including IE. That makes it all the more difficult to determine exactly which browser is truly tops in the browser wars.

I guess the way I look at is this: Browsers that emulate IE aren't necessarily providing a 100% emulation. As a result, I believe if the figures would probably show that IE users compared to other browsers as a group would definitely be less than the 90% or higher level some would have us believe.

In other words, IE may have a higher market share compared to each individual browser, but this would not necessarily be true to such a dramatic extent if the total number of non-IE browser users was compared to the total number of IE browser users.


And another thought occurs after reading your article.

Originally Posted by Article

With the advent of AOL 8.0 (which will use a Netscape browser) the paradigm will shift away from IE.

The article you posted is about a year old. So that begs another question.

What effect do you think the layoffs of all those AOL/Netscape employees earlier this month will have on the trend away from IE?I know AOL is saying that they will continue to support Netscape, but it looks like they're planning on lying down with Microsoft again.

Syren

[TheWebDoctor(tm)]

That interview was done July 2002.

The advent of AOL going back to IE in AOL9 swings the paradigm back to IE emulating software. However, it does not swing the issues back to IE as a piece of software that over shadows the others on an aggregate view point.

Gecko has the widest used number of browser variants. People that want to say Netscape forget or simply don't realize that since N6 the engine is Gecko. Although the browsers do emulate Netscape/Mozilla.

I still think that as more people become educated to the problems with IE more people will start using more secure and reliable software applications. There will still be those that are lazy (which MS is relying upon) that don't try to get a better browser simply because of download times or the lack of easy upgrading since Netscape 6.

The old Smart Update was an awesome feature. Now you have to download the entire package each time. That 18+Meg download is burdensome on dial up connections. Not to mention that upgrading from NN4 is murder on the less than astute computer user.

Because of the issues with downloading any software for browsing on the WWW, people tend to not upgrade until they get a new computer which of course has IE on it. Even Macs come with MacIE on it, the last time I checked, while Apple developed Safari which is included as well.

So, will it ever push IE to the 90% mark? I seriously doubt it as Linux is being shipped on desktops now and is climbing the desktop user lists.

I even seriously doubt that IE will push 60%. The last real report I saw that took the "real world" metrics into account showed IE at only 40%. Unfortunately, it's been a year since that report and I don't want to again show a report that's more that six months old - not to mention I'd have to find it again.

I don't keep physical notes of everything. Although some may think I do. :)

I hope this has helped to some degree.

Thanks for the question Syren.

[SyrenSong]

Originally Posted by WebDoctor

I hope this has helped to some degree.

Thanks for the question Syren.

The added info was a definite help. As for stats, let's face it - they're always changing in the computer industry.

As for the question - asking is the best way to learn something new! ;)

Thanks again for the additional information, Lee.

Syren

[Ron]

I have to go with J_Paul all the way. I use MSIE 6.0 simply because I realize it's what the vast majority of my visitors will view my sites in. I test in Netscape and, when I think about it, in Opera as well.

At one time, it was 'give and take' between MSIE and Netscape. I mean, some things that were viewed easily in IE sent Netscape into a tailspin and vice-versa. Now, with the latest of both versions installed, they are closer to being compatible than I can ever recall.

There's my 2 cents worth!

[mpnev]

Opera my personal favorite... Why? Because it's strict and doesn't let me get away with making mistakes on my websites... If it looks good in Opera - it more than likely looks good in all browsers...

I test all site designs on ALL browsers though...

[carju1]

My favourite is Netscape for useability as a web surfer but I tend to use IE for most things. Why because its the one most of my users use.

site Stats by browser type last 2 months
IE 492,000
Netscape 38,000
Opera 3,000
Others 10,000
crawlers/bots 28,000

So its simple if 90% of my hits are from IE (286k=IE6, 198k=IE5, 8k=IE4) everything had better work in IE, so by default I'd better know how it works better than my users and therefore I'd better use it more than my users. Therefore I reluctantly use IE for most of my web time.

Until about 2 years ago I stood firm and refused to have IE on my pc at home but: time, tides and the allmighty MS wait for no man, so I gave in eventually :(

Julian

[TheWebDoctor(tm)]

So its simple if 90% of my hits are from IE (286k=IE6, 198k=IE5, 8k=IE4) everything had better work in IE, so by default I'd better know how it works better than my users and therefore I'd better use it more than my users.

Ok, so either the less educated and lazy forced you into a decision that you knew was wrong OR you willingly jumped off the cliff to join them. Either way you joined the crowd. Some would commend you on giving in and some would consider you a traitor.

It makes no difference which browser people use. However it does make a difference to me if they begin to program only for IE. By your statements and your stats you show that people utilize other browsers.

Now, the one thing you have to be careful about when you start citing your stats like that is they are always incorrect. You can show me stats all day and I'll continue to inform you that they are wrong.

Here's the reasons why.

1. Browsers can mask themselves as IE so they can access a site. Take Opera as an example.
2. Assistive technologies often mask themselves as IE to utilize sites.
3. Email harvesters often mask themselves as IE to get beyond the email harvester blocks/denials.
4. Some search bots will mask themselves as IE.

So, to make things clear - IE stats are never accurately shown.

I hope this helps.