google & ODP

[fathom]

Originally Posted by Dave Hawley

Like I say, what happens with alpha links, links that are added in the oder they are found.

Good question!

Sucks to be "ZZZ Beds"! :-)

Actually nothing different than anything else that has both advantages and disadvantages.

Some examples:

1. What happens to the site the doesn't use H Tags

2. What happens to the site that doesn't add anything to the title element

3. If we use DMOZ as your example of alpha links link and one site has A1 and listed first and another Steak Sauce Ltd and listed last - well A1 gets more weight for top of page while Steak Sauce gets more weight for Keyphrase that better matches the search query.

So what's the problem?

There is 100 variables and no single one out-performs the other 99.

[Mel]

Hi Fathom
I agree with you that the text content of an anchor text link might get more or less ranking "points" attributable to the linking page dependant on the location of the link, but I fail to see why it should pass more than the normal ranking to the linked page, if this is in fact what you are saying.

I really doubt that the Google link indexing mechanism includes the position of the link on the page, or for that matter why it should. In the PR context a link is considered a vote and the only considerations affecting the vote are the PR of the linking Pages and the number of outbound links, so in this case there is no

In the case of anchor text links I can see that Google index the url of both the linking and the linked page, and the linking text, but seriously doubt that they add a factor based on the location of the link on the page. Can you give me your understanding of why you think this may be so?

[sparshpolly]

Hi all,
I didnt have time to read all the posts in this thread so please dont mind if I am trying to put forward the same thing.

ODP is time consuming for sure , it is hard to get in and all its other drawbacks but still it remains the major place where a webmaster should aim at getting his site placed.

My site got a listing in ODP (now its not my site anymore) in February this year and from then its PR has risen up from 4 to 7.
Thousands of sites use the ODP data and getting a listing in there means getting a listing in the top notch sites of the web.

And for those who think ODP is crap I have a question : Do you think a free Yahoo or any other reputable directory comes easy ?

Have a nice day,
Sparsh

[Dave Hawley]

So what's the problem?

I fail to see how pointing out those theories goes anyhere near exlaining why Google would give more importance to pages that have top placed links. You are saying that Google might do "A" so it's now fact it does "B".

You have also not answered my question on just how Google would give more importance?

There is 100 variables and no single one out-performs the other 99.

That a very big contradiction considering you are constantly stating anchor text is the king.

Sorry guys, I have seen or heard nothing that would indicate Google give more importance (still waiting on a exaplanation on that) to pages which are lucky enough to have top placed links.

This is exactly the sort of unfounded myths that cause no end of ludicrous spin-offs.

[sfowler]

I have a feeling that the foreign language sections of ODP are not as overloaded as the English ones. It took me a long time to get madurusa.com list, whilst madur.at went quite quickly. This may be simple luck, and maybe www.madur.at/index_gb.html will be rejected for not being the main URL, or for being too similar to madurusa.com. If so, then I will just have to make some changes. I do use the directory myself when I am researching something, but not when I am trying to buy something. The structure does not seem to suit purchase, and why should it? It is not designed for that. I will still try to get any website I am working on into the ODP.

[Dave Hawley]

I will still try to get any website I am working on into the ODP.

Absolutely! As it's free and takes about 5 mins to submit no reason not to. Just don't beat yourself up should you not get in, it's nothing more than a web page with x PR and x links pointing out.

[simonm]

I dipped into the ODP discussion and was glad to see that CBP was standing up for ODP but where was Mr Glover and Minstrel??

CBP will of course remember the ODP discussion that just ran and ran like the Duracell bunny!

http://www.webproworld.com/viewtopic...er+odp&start=0

Interesting that we have the same debate, more interesting that different people almost a year later are making the same comments - ODP has had its day etc etc. Its almost worth staying with WPW in the very long term to see if in 5 years time there are still people saying that ODP is irrelevant and getting very heated about it!

[Dave Hawley]

ODP has had its day etc etc

Probably true. However, it's hard not to believe that DMOZ is of less value now, than a few years ago.

They are miles behind in adding submitted sites in many categories. Basically the volunteer system cannot keep up the the growth of the WWW and simply does not work well.

Google directory updates seem to be less frequent.

Google no longer have a link to the directory on their homepage.

Traffic from DMOZ is now almost non-existent.

Other than a small amount of PR (which you could get from any page with the same PR and links out) there is little going for it IMO.

[cbp]

Dave - lets call a truce before this gets started :-)

I'll just comment on this:

They are miles behind in adding submitted sites in many categories. Basically the volunteer system cannot keep up the the growth of the WWW and simply does not work well.

I came across a good comment from a senior editor the other day - sorry forgot where. But it was something like, that if all the spammy affiliate sites; the duplicate submissions; the massive amount of deeplink submissions (many times there are hundreds of submission of pages from sites; and lots of submission to lots of different categories) were somehow magically removed from the suggestion pool overnight and all submitted sites were actually submitted to the correct category, then the back log of sites would be cleared and listed within a matter of days.

I think what he was trying to say, is that it is all this crap and its investigation to keep out the spammers that is taking up more of an editors time than actually getting on the with job of listing those that are worthy. The volunteer system would work well without the rubbish editors have to deal with.

Don't blame DMOZ - blame those crappy submissions.

CBP

[Dave Hawley]

I think what he was trying to say, is that it is all this crap and its investigation to keep out the spammers that is taking up more of an editors time than actually getting on the with job of listing those that are worthy. The volunteer system would work well without the rubbish editors have to deal with.

Totally agree. However, I would suggest DMOZ spell out on their submission page that, links in the directory will do no more good for Google rankings that any other page with the same PR and outward links.

IMO, the reason for so much spam is the fallacy that a DMOZ link is somehow more valued by Google than other pages.

Perhaps also they should introduce some automated system to check if the page being submitted is already included in DMOZ. IMO a volunteer system can only do so much.

[saghir69]

heyas every one is taking a dig at dmoz, so i might aswell add my opinion.

i'm sure they must be doing the best then can, but i think they need to chill out a bit. the editors and mods are way to agresive and are always ready to jump on people who want some info about their submition! and anyone who has been to thier forum would know that!

After looking at the state of the forum i created a thread "yesterday" called "genral chit chat and relaxing zone"
but its deleted now!

[sfowler]

They may not link to DMOZ from the home page, but Google.at still has them in the suggestion for webmasters at http://www.google.at/intl/de/webmasters/1.html#B2
So I don't think they are completely ignored. Mind you, they also mention the Yahoo directory, but no others by name.

[Dave Hawley]

After looking at the state of the forum i created a thread "yesterday" called "genral chit chat and relaxing zone"
but its deleted now!

That is soooo funny and just like Recource (AKA Resource) Zone!

They may not link to DMOZ from the home page, but Google.at still has them in the suggestion for webmasters at http://www.google.at/intl/de/webmasters/1.html#B2

Glad you mentioned that! This is just one of the many reasons why DMOZ editors get so much spam. They see Google single out one site as a "suggestion for webmasters" and then think that's the silver bullet.