help:What is Google PR leaking?

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by janeth

Yes, it is.

You meant it was NOT misleading? There is your "bucket" leaking water! don't you see? And as i confirmed before - it was correct but missing some info! Taken from my post: The main "bucket" doesn't lose its power for internal pages by pouring to external. External nofollow seals help other externally linked pages! Internal seals help internal pages linked with dofollow. External and internal links do not compete!!

As a matter of fact I knew about before everyone started talking about page rank sculpting.

Oh, "i knew it first" "Everyone started talking" Does look familiar! It is not a Paris Hilton world, or may be it is in some cases when people start gossip about Google, making Page rank sculpting facts into PR leaking fears! LHC will destroy our planet nonsense!

P.S. While you study and test, please also mind other factors effecting your SERPS and PR as there are so many of them!

[kgun]

Originally Posted by janeth

Yes, it is.

Did you read the comments?

[janeth]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

You meant it was NOT misleading? There is your "bucket" leaking water! don't you see? And as i confirmed before - it was correct but missing some info! Taken from my post: The main "bucket" doesn't lose its power for internal pages by pouring to external. External nofollow seals help other externally linked pages! Internal seals help internal pages linked with dofollow. External and internal links do not compete!!

You've changed 100% from what you started saying.

The topic is about links leaking pr, everyone knows we can plug bot internal and external links with nofollow.

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

Oh, "i knew it first" "Everyone started talking" Does look familiar! It is not a Paris Hilton world, or may be it is in some cases when people start gossip about Google making Page rank sculpting facts into PR leaking fears! LHC will destroy our planet nonsense!

While you study and test, please also mind other factors effecting your SERPS and PR as there are so many of them!

I never said I knew it first, but then you flip flop so much it's starting to bore me.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by kgun

Did you read the comments?

No I didn't, I think I missed what it was trying to say.

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by janeth

You've changed 100% from what you started saying.

The topic is about links leaking pr, everyone knows we can plug bot internal and external links with nofollow.



I never said I knew it first, but then you flip flop so much it's starting to bore me.

I knew about before everyone

Means exactly: i knew it first


OMG!! I can see you do not understand what you read, you do get it better when they draw pictures for you and examples with money, buckets etc... I guess i'll have to ignore your comments as they sound naive to me and i have no time for that! Really...

[kgun]

I think you may be correct on that it is misleading, but do you know more than that article says?

A popularized description of

Google PageRank - Introduction

Brin's and Pages original paper.

Related Thread:

Internal and external links and the rel="nofollow" attribute

that was a follow up of this

Links::: Life or death of your eBusiness.

thread.

This

http://www.webworkshop.net/pagerank.html

is well know by you Janeth.

So how are the algorithms changed?

[janeth]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

Means exactly: i knew it first

You really should run for office. You are about as misleading as one can get. How about if you quote the whole sentence and not one small part of it, then you want make me think of you so poorly.

Originally Posted by janeth

As a matter of fact I knew about before everyone started talking about page rank sculpting.

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

OMG!! I guess i'll have to ignore your comments as they sound naive to me and i have no time for that! Really...

Please do as you seem to feel the need to be correct even if it means changing directions.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by kgun

I think you may be correct on that it is misleading, but do you know more than that article says?

A popularized description of

Google PageRank - Introduction

Brin's and Pages original paper.

Related Thread:

Internal and external links and the rel="nofollow" attribute

that was a follow up of this

Links::: Life or death of your eBusiness.

thread.

This

Pagerank Explained. Google's PageRank and how to make the most of it.

is well know by you Janeth.

So how are the algorithms changed?

Here’s all I know. PR is divided by the number of links leaving a page. It does not matter if it is onsite or offsite. By controlling the flow of PR we are able to funnel the PR to the pages we want.

Depending on the amount of PR we control we can make a big difference, a small difference or no difference at all in our ranking.

Everything I know about it I learned from Phil Craven many years ago.

[Webnauts]

Originally Posted by janeth

Here’s all I know. PR is divided by the number of links leaving a page. It does not matter if it is onsite or offsite. By controlling the flow of PR we are able to funnel the PR to the pages we want.

Depending on the amount of PR we control we can make a big difference, a small difference or no difference at all in our ranking.

Everything I know about it I learned from Phil Craven many years ago.

I have a question. I have a page with PR 6. If I link out to 4 external sites, how much PR will be left over for my page?

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

I have a question. I have a page with PR 6. If I link out to 4 external sites, how much PR will be left over for my page?

According to some posts here its : $6-4=$2 so you will have PR2

[Webnauts]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

According to some posts here its : $6-4=$2 so you will have PR2

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat??? Shit man! Then I have to get rid of them if that is the case. So please be honest and advice man.

I am talking about my tool page by the way.

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat??? Shit man! Then I have to get rid of them if that is the case. So please be honest and advice man.

I am talking about my tool page by the way.

Oh no no, lets divide: 6:4=1,5 Hurry or you loose it all LOL

[Webnauts]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

Oh no no, lets divide: 6:4=1,5 Hurry or you loose it all LOL

Damn! Then I need to add my new nofollow rule "googlebot-nocrawl". Did you notice that already on some of my links?

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

Damn! Then I need to add my new nofollow rule "googlebot-nocrawl". Did you notice that already on some of my links?

No worries buddy, you will not lose any PRfor your own internal PR value, the more outbound dofollow links you add the less PR will be passed to each of those sites, thats all. Your toolbar PR will stay the same. On the other hand if you have 20 internal pages linked from that page with dofollow your Internal PR might loosen a bit! We can treat PR flow separately as Internal flow and external flow, as i pointed above they do not compete!

[Webnauts]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

No worries buddy, you will not lose any PRfor your own internal PR value, the more outbound dofollow links you add the less PR will be passed to each of them, thats all. Your toolbar PR will stay the same. On the other hand if you have 20 internal pages linked from that page with dofollow your Internal PR might loosen a bit! We can treat PR flow separately as Internal flow and external flow, as i pointed above they do not compete!

I thought you already realized that I was kidding man! Again

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

I thought you already realized that I was kidding man! Again

Oh, i was talking serious to the other members as we joke with you here all the time

[Russianzio12]

Notice to all the webmasters here: New "googlebot-nocrawl" attribute is out! Buy using it you can increase your PR value by linking to other sites! Say, link to 100 sites and you get PR100!! Act now and you get a bonus of 10! Link away guys!

[Webnauts]

Oh sorry man. I will get serious from now on.

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

Oh sorry man. I will get serious from now on.

We can be serious about our work on our sites, its fine to laugh here sometimes, and why not?

[Webnauts]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

We can be serious about our work on our sites, its fine to laugh here sometimes, and why not?

Laughing is good for the heart! OK. Back to topic. I do not want Google to pick up my off-topic posts and spoil my linking profile.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

We can treat PR flow separately as Internal flow and external flow, as i pointed above they do not compete!

lol, and where is your proof that there are two pr flows?

[janeth]

SEOmoz | How PageRank Works & Why the Original PR Formula May be Flawed

Maybe this will help.

[crankydave]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

There is no negative result in this case! By linking to other sites you do not lose your internal power, only the external one.

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

According to some posts here its : $6-4=$2 so you will have PR2

No it is not.

I believe you are very confused. First PR is function of inbound links.

Each page has a finite amount of PR it can pass (vote) to other pages. Doesn't matter how much. If ANY of that PR is passed to an external page it cannot be passed to an internal page.

@ John... Your toolbar PR 6 page will have the amount of PR left to pass internally that is not passed by the external links. If someone claims to know exactly how internal PR is reflected by the silly toolbar, or exactly how it is divided up... post it.

Dave

[Russianzio12]

Dave, this was the original formula of Larry and Sergey. Alot of time passed since than and things changed alot. What you are saying was the fact a very long time ago when the algorithm was young and naive as a newborn baby!! This formula still remains as an official stamp and the actual situation can only be guessed or tested by webmasters. We all have our knowlage that we acquired from practice and not only from reading in forums and SEO blogs and that knowlage is precise for each of us.

I am sure you do have 90% of your valuable knowlage of SEO that you wouldn't share with anyone, you can breefly state one thing but never go into details! We do not share info in details just like Google doesn't. If they told you all about the algo, the whole Google empire would collapse!!!

And:
I agree that the "silly" green toolbar is not the tool to calculate your actual PR value the same applies to the basic info that Google gives us. They show us the Solar system and how the planets spin, and its up to you if you spot life on the planet Earth and go deeper into how to split atom!

[kgun]

Originally Posted by janeth

Everything I know about it I learned from Phil Craven many years ago.

He is one of the experts in the field, and since you are on his forum, you ought to be well informed.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

Dave, this was the original formula of Larry and Sergey.

There were never two sets of pr.

[kgun]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

Damn! Then I need to add my new nofollow rule "googlebot-nocrawl". Did you notice that already on some of my links?

John, why not use advanced semantic linking and delegate different roles to links? That is a more consistent way to do it.

John, with all due respect, now I think you have come up with n models to work around the rel="nofollow" attribute:

1. Using a CSS class or Id (like I have suggested myself).
2. Using .htaccess and robots.txt
3. Use or not use meta tags.
4. Use microformats.
5. Other methods like you find in the very good PrSculpting thread:
   
   Does PR Sculpting Work?
6. I think you have mentioned other methods too??

Google / Yahoo

advanced semantic linking

Here is the #1 hit on Yahoo and Google.

Yahoo (have not checked it in Google)

xml will revolutionize linking

Here is the #1 hit on Yahoo.

It is 2009

[kgun]

Originally Posted by crankydave

No it is not.
I believe you are very confused. First PR is function of inbound links.

Amen.

Originally Posted by crankydave

If someone claims to know exactly how internal PR is reflected by the silly toolbar, or exactly how it is divided up... post it.

I have an algorithm in my head. It is a non-linear projection from a high dimensional unknown system to the interval [0,10].

It is very difficult to decipher though.

But I can tell you that stable (hopefully semantic) inbound links are an important input.

[kgun]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

Dave, this was the original formula of Larry and Sergey. Alot of time passed since than and things changed alot.

I have modified it on my Blog.

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by kgun

I have modified it on my Blog.

Your article "THE PROTOCOLS OF THE LEARNED ELDERS OF ZION" makes alot of sense to me and its just 1 centimeter of an iceberg of details and other formulas hidden in Googleplex!

[kgun]

1. In a sense mathematics is objective. Mathematics (calculous) does not lie. If your calculation is correct, you have to look at the assumptions.
2. Mathematical algorithms, pagerank can be manipulated.
3. People can be lobbied.

[crankydave]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

Dave, this was the original formula of Larry and Sergey. Alot of time passed since than and things changed alot. What you are saying was the fact a very long time ago when the algorithm was young and naive as a newborn baby!! This formula still remains as an official stamp and the actual situation can only be guessed or tested by webmasters. We all have our knowlage that we acquired from practice and not only from reading in forums and SEO blogs and that knowlage is precise for each of us.

It never ceases to amaze me how easily such a simple concept get's confused.

1. Every page has a finite amount of PR it can pass (vote) to other pages.
2. That available PR is passed (voted) via links on the page.
3. Those links on the page can either pass (vote) the available PR to an internal page or an external page.
4. ANY amount of PR that is passed (voted) to an external page CANNOT be passed (voted) to an internal page.
5. The amount of PR that is passed (voted) to an external page is considered to be "leaked".

That's all there is. I'm not sure I can explain it a whole lot simpler than that but let's try this...

I have 10 eggs that I can pass to myself or pass onto someone else. If I pass 1 of those eggs on to you, I no longer have 10 eggs to pass to myself.

I have "X" PR that I can pass to myself or pass onto someone else. If I pass "Y" PR on to you, I only have "X - Y" PR to pass to myself. The amount of PR that equals "Y" is considered to be "leaked".

Understand?

Dave

[Russianzio12]

The same song all over again. I understood that from the begining of Google! There is no need repeating the same thing, Dave. Can you just look aside from this and consider a different scenario?

You have "X" PR in your Swiss bank that you can spend for yourself and there is "Y" PR in your company's City bank account reserved for other needs! When you spend your company money it doesn't touch your Swiss bank! As i said, Google algo is not the same as it was from the beginning! Can you please see what i am talking about? Is that hard? Internal and exterlal links work separately!!!

[crankydave]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

The same song all over again. I understood that from the begining of Google! There is no need repeating the same thing, Dave. Can you just look aside from this and consider a different scenario?

You have "X" PR in your Swiss bank that you can spend for yourself and there is "Y" PR in your company's City bank account reserved for other needs! When you spend your company money it doesn't touch your Swiss bank! As i said, Google algo is not the same as it was from the beginning! Can you please see what i am talking about? Is that hard? Internal and exterlal links work separately!!!

Where in the world did you get that idea?

Dave

[Webnauts]

Can someone tell how much finite amount of PR does every page have that can pass (vote) to other pages?

[full house]

I think depends on the links that has in the site.

[Webnauts]

Originally Posted by full house

I think depends on the links that has in the site.

Can you be more specific please? What you say does not make any sense to me.

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by crankydave

Where in the world did you get that idea?

Dave

In the world of tests and experiments during many years!
Don't look in my sigi, those are not the sites from the experiments.

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by full house

I think depends on the links that has in the site.

The worst punishment would be reading all of your 350 posts and trying to guess what you mean

[crankydave]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

In the world of tests and experiments during many years!
Don't look in my sigi, those are not the sites from the experiments.

Nonsense.

Dave

[crankydave]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

Can someone tell how much finite amount of PR does every page have that can pass (vote) to other pages?

John... Are you being serious?

Dave

[janeth]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

In the world of tests and experiments during many years!
Don't look in my sigi, those are not the sites from the experiments.

I see you removed the links from your sig. that says a lot.

[kevsta]

Originally Posted by Webnauts

I have a question. I have a page with PR 6. If I link out to 4 external sites, how much PR will be left over for my page?

hmm, how about you link to my site and nofollow a few of your internal links?

[kevsta]

Originally Posted by crankydave

It never ceases to amaze me how easily such a simple concept gets confused.

Dave

lol. me too. this is pretty basic stuff.

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by kevsta

lol. me too. this is pretty basic stuff.

Do you think you know all about Google ??? The "basic stuff" is all you know and allowed to know!! You never tried to dig deeper on your own and see how much more complex things are!

[Russianzio12]

Originally Posted by janeth

I see you removed the links from your sig. that says a lot.

What can it say to you Janeth? Its not a drawing for kids, so please stop quoting me here, i have nothing to explan to you.

[Webnauts]

Originally Posted by kevsta

hmm, how about you link to my site and nofollow a few of your internal links?

Nofollow internal links? I strictly don't use the "nofollow" garbage on seoworkers web site. I still do not follow pages that do not need to be indexed and rank.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

What can it say to you Janeth? Its not a drawing for kids, so please stop quoting me here, i have nothing to explan to you.

There is nothing you could explain to me. However, the removing of your sig. shows that you are full of B.S and are ashamed of your own sites.

[crankydave]

Originally Posted by Russianzio12

Do you think you know all about Google ??? The "basic stuff" is all you know and allowed to know!! You never tried to dig deeper on your own and see how much more complex things are!

Oh please.

You try and suggest that PR is now a function based upon the outbound links on a page and cite...

In the world of tests and experiments during many years!
Don't look in my sigi, those are not the sites from the experiments.

...as your basis.

Utter nonsense.

Dave

[Russianzio12]

I'd rather say "its not" if its your misspelling there for "its now" The answer is: the PR for your INTERNAL needs is NOT a function based upon outbound links, on the other hand, the outbound PR power you wanted to give to another site will be less if you have other outbound links,- so it IS a function of outbound links for the outbound PR flow! The internal PR flow works the same, less internal links - more PR power to the page you link to and you link from.

And, the most important! You will not lose your PR authority for serch engine result positions (which is THE number 1 factor for you, i hope) if you link out to other related quality sites! Now, please tell me, have you ever lost your positions because of that?