Lunching New Site on existing domain - What to be aware of??

[ignitionmedia]

Hi there,
I am currently working on re-doing my website which is currently an 800pg static HTML website; the new site will be over 200,000 pages and will be CMS/Database driven.

Currently I hold #2 rankings for a few major keywords and get 40,000 unique visitors a month.

All page extensions will be lost as the new site launches and besides doing a 301 redirect to take care of this aspect of things what else should I be aware of and prepare for?

Having the site go from 800 pages to 200,000 + pages, is this going to cause any red flags in Google? All content is unique and I have had over 1000+ articles written for the new website.

There is a database of business listings that make up the majority of pages, but the remainder will have content rich unique copy from the 1000 articles.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Nicole

[calculator]

Having the site go from 800 pages to 200,000 + pages, is this going to cause any red flags in Google?

in a word ... YES if you switch from 800 to 200K+ overnight. How long have these 800 pages been there? How long did it take you to reach 800 pages? If the site is 'old' and has remained the same for some time, it's even riskier to go from 800 to 200K+

Before going into this any further, could I ask you if you considered launching the new site on a new domain. There are many warnings going up when I read your post. 40K visitors a month is a nice figure and I would be worried about potential problems if my whole income was based on this site. Do the 40K visitors all come from SE?

If you haven't considered launching on a new domain, why not?Is the domain name of the 'old' site that good? You could get both sites running at the same time and - as long as you don't have 800 pages of exact same content - link from the old site to the new saying something like - check out our new website.

Other questions I wonder about are: does the CMS provide search engine friendly URLs? Are you able to check the 301 beforehand (on a test server)? How fast do you want to get the 200K+ pages out?

[ignitionmedia]

How long have these 800 pages been there? How long did it take you to reach 800 pages?

The site is now 2.5 years old and is updated to some extent monthly.

Before going into this any further, could I ask you if you considered launching the new site on a new domain. If you haven't considered launching on a new domain, why not?Is the domain name of the 'old' site that good?

Yes, I do have an alternate domain but this site is my only form of income and had thought that a 301 would be a nice way of keeping my rankings and attracting more visitors. Also the domain name I think helps me get a lot of my visotrs as it has "cheap" in the domain (cheapholidayaccommodation.com) so it covers keywords like "cheap holiday", "holiday accommodation" and of course "cheap holiday accommodation" my alternate domain is australianholidayaccommodation so i loose the power the domain is pulling for the term "cheap". However after having read your post I can see there would be less harm in putting the site on a new domain

Do the 40K visitors all come from SE?

Yes they do

Other questions I wonder about are: does the CMS provide search engine friendly URLs? Are you able to check the 301 beforehand (on a test server)? How fast do you want to get the 200K+ pages out?

Yes - the CMS will output .html pages and everything is SEO freindly down to the CSS, Metas, Titles, Alt tags etc. In regards to testing the 301 on a test server how would I go about doing that? The 200K pages i had just planned to bust out all at once when the new site goes live however if this is not a good move, as the majority of pages will be business listings, i can release these in sections by category over a period of time.

thanks very much for replying to my questions. If you have any other advise it would be very handy and appreciated.

[calculator]

Hi Nicole, first of all may I just say that this is one very, very nice site congratulations!! The domain name is also very nice!

Yes, I do have an alternate domain but this site is my only form of income and had thought that a 301 would be a nice way of keeping my rankings and attracting more visitors.

Do you know where your visitors are coming from? I am asking because if mainly australian based, you could get similar results with the australian domain, otherwise people might be put off.

301 usually works well to maintain rankings and PR - I never had any troubles with it - but I never did a 301 to such an extent (mine were redirectMatch when I changed file extension and then a couple of unique 301 when some pages got removed - but that was for 50 or less pages sites).

In regards to testing the 301 on a test server how would I go about doing that?

Create a subdomain or buy a cheap domain. Block all spiders from going through it. Upload your old site (800 pages). Upload the .htaccess with the redirect from old url's to new url's. Run a link checker and make sure that all the urls that the server header response is 301 and that the 404 response correspond to the newly created url's.

Once / if you upload the new site to the old domain run a link checker again to make sure everything's ok.

The 200K pages i had just planned to bust out all at once when the new site goes live however if this is not a good move, as the majority of pages will be business listings, i can release these in sections by category over a period of time.

Not a good idea if on the old domain, ok to start with 200K+ if new domain (paradoxical isn't it).

Will the 200K+ pages all be business listings? Do they bring much to your site in terms of quality info for your visitors?

Because the 'old' site is your main source of revenue, I would launch the new site on a new domain / the other domain. But I would do this only if the content is different enough to not penalise your old site (ie. you may have to rewrite the 800 pages of the old site if you used them in the new).

Keep updating the old site at the same frequency you did before (if you can) and work on the new site as well. Link from the old site to the new on your homepage with a single link to let people know about the new site.

By having two site you get a bit more work to update both, but you also have a 'security' blanket if one falls over.

Hope this help.

calculator

[dimareli]

About 2 years ago i moved a site from html based to a new one (cms based) on the same domain and lost most of the rankings in SEarch Engines, lost a lot of visitors and 50% down on earnings from this website.

After 2 years i still have problem with rankings on Google for some significant keywords.

So it is better to go with a new domain, link from the old one to the new one, try to avoid content duplicates and when you are sure can 301 redirect to the new one.

[sensei]

I'd carefully change the old pages, I'd try to keep the content that will show up on the new pages as close as it was showing on the old pages, plus I'd not change the old URLs for nothing, even if 301 redirections will be put in place ( it rarely happens to get the positions you had before when changing URLs of old pages ).

[Orion]

I agree, I don't know for sure if it would redflag, however my gut says oh ya!

I would gradually add the pages, this will also have the benefit of doing something the SEs seem to love... a growing site.

Same as you don't go and pay someone to get you 1000 links to your site this month...

[jomariet]

The other thing to do is to write a little ap that will overwrite your static pages from your CMS system. It's an extra step - but can help you keep those .htm or .html pages AND use the new system. I've done that with coldfusion on smaller sites and it worked well without losing any SERP.

[ignitionmedia]

Do you know where your visitors are coming from? I am asking because if mainly australian based, you could get similar results with the australian domain, otherwise people might be put off.

Yes, I 80% of my visitors are Aussies. I do have cheapholidayaccommodation.com.au so this is another option as an alternate domain to launch the website on.

Will the 200K+ pages all be business listings? Do they bring much to your site in terms of quality info for your visitors?

There is over 130,000 business listings and each which will have a google maps, add comments form and the ability to email the businesses on each page so the pages wont just be the business details for the sake of adding a page. They will act as a reference or guide for people wanting to get in contact with businesses in the tourism industry to further book or arrange activities for their holiday.

I would launch the new site on a new domain / the other domain. But I would do this only if the content is different enough to not penalise your old site

Yeah besides the accommodation listings which for the most part have to list the same facilities, features and description everything else will be unique content.

By having two site you get a bit more work to update both, but you also have a 'security' blanket if one falls over.

thats great - thanks everyone for all your advise. I will upload on a new domain with the new website.

[incrediblehelp]

1.Why in the world would someone want to change from a domain that is 2.5 years old to one that is brand new? I would not as you would be basically starting from scratch.

2.Remember not all the pages are driving all your traffic. Have you considered only 301 redirecting the ones that are ranking and getting traffic and forgetting about the rest?

3.Have you considered adding the content slowly? Why do you have to add it over night?

4.Keywords in the domains matter very, very, very little. Changing domains for this reason is a poor choice.

5.How unique are these new pages? Are they just template pages with business addresses on them? If so don’t worry as most of them will probably not rank at all and just be thrown into the SI.

6.Take advice in forums with a grain of salt. As you should not be making this large of business decisions from just reading this thread. You should probably consider hiring someone to help you with this since you are not sure what to exactly do.

7.Here is some 301 redirection help:

Passing Link Juice with 301 Redirects

301 Redirect Resources and Help - Jaan’s Search Marketing and SEO Blog from Cincinnati, Ohio

[Tubby]

I am inclined to think that the 800 static pages would not convert into 200k pages without a considerable change in content.

Without looking closely my initial feeling is create the new site. . then run it in competition with your old one. For the life of me I just cannot see a duplicate content issue if you totally rearrange the format.

For example a result for houses under $100,000 - will never have similar content to house in Sydney.

I would compete with myself. . That should be tough enough competition to upgrade both sites.

in a few years to come - succeed the losing site to the winner...


P.S. incredible said ( I think I agree)
You should probably consider hiring someone to help you with this since you are not sure what to exactly do.


BIG step! - do not screw it up. what you have now would have taken a hell of a lot of work....

[joncase]

Originally Posted by incrediblehelp

6.Take advice in forums with a grain of salt. As you should not be making this large of business decisions from just reading this thread. You should probably consider hiring someone to help you with this since you are not sure what to exactly do.

You are one wise dude.