PPC vs Organic Results

[janeth]

I've seen a lot of people posting on different forums that either PPC does not work or that it does not work as well as organic results. I have to wonder how much these people know about setting up a page for PPC.

Paid Per Click works as well or better than organic results if it is done correctly but then there are very few people that understand how to do them correctly and this is the reason so many people say organic is better.

With Google AdWords I'm able to build a site for my visitors. If I want to use pictures, graphics or anything else to help convert that visitor into a customer, it does not matter. The site is 100% for the visitor and has nothing to so with the search engines.

Everything I do is about improving conversion rates and this starts with the keywords I choose. If I'm selling 18kt gold earrings then I do not want to bid on keywords like; jewelery, gold, earrings, rings, neck lesses or anything else that does not describe my product perfectly. The idea is to convert every single person that lands on that page. My keywords could be things like;

18kt gold earrings
Custom 18kt gold earrings
earring 18kt gold

and the list can go on and on describing my earrings to the point that any visitor that lands on that page will get exactly what he wants. Also the more exact my keywords the less the competition and the less I have to pay for each click.

Once I get my list of keywords together I need to create a page for each of the keywords and create those pages for converting visitors.

If my keyword is going to be 18kt gold rabbit earrings then the page they land on should have pictures of the 18kt gold rabbit earrings, the first line of text should say 18kt gold rabbit earrings, we should have text that tells them what's in it for them and a call to action that guides them in the direction we want them to go.

The conversion is effected by the navigation, motivation, and trustworthiness of the landing page.

Now that we have the pages set up we need to add our keywords into AdWords.

AdWords comes with broad match set as it's default setting. This means that if my keywords are 18kt gold earrings my keywords will show for anything with 18kt gold earrings. Examples; 18kt earrings gold, Zales gold earrings and 18kt rings, Colombian 18kt gold and silver earrings. While you may rank for keywords you did not think of you will also rank for a lot of keywords you did not want to.

The AdWords also come with the default setting that allows you to rank for things you've never thought of. Let's say my keyword is 18kt Colombian Gold Earrings, this default setting allows me to rank for 14kt Colombian Gold, Colombian Jewelery, Colombian silver and many others. The advantages are that I rank for keywords I never thought of the disadvantage is that I rank for keywords I never wanted to.

By Placing square brackets around my keywords I change this setting. [Colombian 18kt gold earrings] now I will only rank for that keyword when it is typed in exactly that way.

There is a lot more to the AdWords then this but I only wanted to make a point that the AdWords do work better or as well as the organic searches, if they are set up correctly and that there is a lot more to setting them up then just throwing some keywords together and starting to bid on Google. When someone says that they have tested and tried them and that the organic searches did better I have to wonder if they set them up correctly.

I'm not saying not to do SEO but don't leave out the PPC.

[achronister]

Good post. PPC should work just as well or better than organic assuming you bring in targeted traffic. Throwing up a giant list of keywords and not testing and refining it isn't going to work, and the same goes with your ad copy.

Most of the rantings about PPC not working are by people who don't understand how to correctly do it. If you're new to the PPC world, just learn as much as you can and get started. It will always require testing different methods and refining what you have.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by achronister

Good post. PPC should work just as well or better than organic assuming you bring in targeted traffic. Throwing up a giant list of keywords and not testing and refining it isn't going to work, and the same goes with your ad copy.

Most of the rantings about PPC not working are by people who don't understand how to correctly do it. If you're new to the PPC world, just learn as much as you can and get started. It will always require testing different methods and refining what you have.

I left out testing but I had already left out so much other stuff and the post seemed to be getting a bit long.

But I agree, one of the most important parts is testing.

[adacprogramming]

PPC is actually one of the best ways to test keywords. Get your results as specific as possible. If there are still enough results to make it worth while, THEN start your organic work.

This way you know where the people are before you go to the effort of opimizing your page for a given keyphrase.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by adacprogramming

PPC is actually one of the best ways to test keywords. Get your results as specific as possible. If there are still enough results to make it worth while, THEN start your organic work.

This way you know where the people are before you go to the effort of opimizing your page for a given keyphrase.

I didn't think about that but it can really save you some time and money before doing any type of SEO work.

[COWDENPARK]

Used to work for me (while I was in google sandbox)..50 clicks per conversion..and thats using PPC godfather tools! (www.perrymarshall.com)
now it no longer works for me :( 1000 clicks or more before a conversion! utterly useless!..and yahoo is the same..
don't tell me im doing something wrong...its the competition out there..!
When i started it was 5 million advertisers...now its MEGA! check out car rental!
any tips u so called pros?

[eagent]

Janeth, you are so right.

I've done them both (and still do). It's a process, not a "set it and forget it" play.

An additional approach I'd like to mention is what I call "Long-form PPC" or "Persistent PPC".

Once I have collected my keywords from Google's suggestion box and my own research, I do the following:

1) Create a press release, primed with the top 3 keyphrases on your list.

2) Upload it to PRWeb.com, and optimize the URL and Technorati tagging, as well as images and attachments (I recommend at least one optimized PDF as well).

3) Post for a Tuesday release.

4) Create your landing pages and optimize your conversion process.

5) Do it again.

The press release acts as a long-form (350-800 word) advertisement... but more subtle and often more powerful. It's broadcast into the news and syndication channels, and to journalists and other media folks, the blogsphere, etc.

So they visit your press release based on keyword searches, then click the links within the copy (use your keywords as anchor tags) and are even exposed to your landing page in the press release's iFrame at the bottom of the page on PRWeb.

I find that once I've nailed my keyphrases and the conversion process, I can achieve a very significant click-to-conversion rate (I find that the more expensive the product, the more iterative my conversion process tends t be. A $20 item is a one-element conversion, whereas a $500 item might be a series of 3-7 iterations to create a dedicated conversion, and an evangelist for the product).

Each press release also acts as an optimized page of content that lasts indefinitely, which is always good (and you can iterate the links at any time, as well as the keywords, so you can fine-tune legacy releases to make them perform even better over time).

Anyhow, using this approach, and layering multiple releases over 4-6 weeks, I can usually dominate my keyphrases and create a nice blended campaign using PPC, PR and SEO.

Best of success to everyone this coming year. It promises to be phenomenal.
Best,
ME

[Tom O'Leary]

Originally Posted by eagent

Anyhow, using this approach, and layering multiple releases over 4-6 weeks, I can usually dominate my keyphrases and create a nice blended campaign using PPC, PR and SEO.

Best of success to everyone this coming year. It promises to be phenomenal.
Best,
ME

Well said Mark. Keyword rich, sticky, multi-channel distribution will only heighten PPC campaign success. By the way, I hope things continue to go well for you! Get in touch if you're ever in Bellingham!

All the best

Tom O'Leary

[craigmn3]

Okay I am kind of up and down here on this issue.

First Off Janeth...you sound a little like a cheerleader....you don't have any affiliation with the pay per click industry I am sure.

Now...PPC is wonderful because you are freed from the mindless robot rubbing that is required for SEO on organic listing. When you are free of that burden you can freely and without a care , cater to your customer. Well except for the $5000.00 a month PPC fee, that's a care.
Now we sell big ticket items. When you sell a 3000.00 pool, the 1.25 you had to pay for the click seems minimal....as do the other 100 clicks that were just looking....and the 75 clicks from competetors and the 312 from click fraud.....
Hmm. It seems to me that there has to be a narrow spectrum of Profits and Losses where PPC makes sense.

IF you can organize your site to your keywords , and cater to your customer and get high Organic listings.....then there is no need to pay per click.

Perhaps I just don't understand the PPC mentality
but my organic listings are pretty high right now....here's hoping I never have to have a PPC mentality.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by craigmn3

When you are free of that burden you can freely and without a care , cater to your customer.

You did get that part right.

Originally Posted by craigmn3

Well except for the $5000.00 a month PPC fee, that's a care.
Now we sell big ticket items. When you sell a 3000.00 pool, the 1.25 you had to pay for the click seems minimal....as do the other 100 clicks that were just looking....and the 75 clicks from competetors and the 312 from click fraud.....
Hmm. It seems to me that there has to be a narrow spectrum of Profits and Losses where PPC makes sense.

The reason for my post was to show you how to avoid all these losses but maybe you were to busy looking for cheerleaders to see that.

Originally Posted by craigmn3

IF you can organize your site to your keywords , and cater to your customer and get high Organic listings.....then there is no need to pay per click.

That all depends on what your trying to do. Anyone can rank a site, it's just a matter of throwing links at it until it ranks. But if your trying to get the most you can out of your site then PPC is an important part of that.

As a matter of fact PPC will convert better then SEO if done correctly but then your making all the money you need to make so you have no reason to waste your time on PPC. Doing PPC the way I'm talking about is for people that want to make more money then they are currently making.

[simonm]

Here's how I see it. Ignoring the actual landing page, a well positioned page - SEO in the top 3 or 4, will get between 25% down to maybe 10% of visitors searching for a particular key phrase, a PPC link will get maybe 3% click through for the same phrase.

BUT.. Those customers who eventually use ppc after 1st looking at the organic results will I guess be more commercially minded, by that I mean in a buying mode. The ppc leading the customer to a highly focused web page should have a better chance at converting than an SEO page which might not be the one I particularly want the customer to land on.

So, I would agree that ppc leads to more conversions per click through than SEO, but personally I would prefer to be No1 for the key term, though I usually aim to have a ppc advert for the sake of understanding the overall number of people doing a particular search.

Happy New Year

Simon

[kneelsit]

Well said Craig. I definitely agree with your comments. The writers so far all sound to me to be touting for business but they are not the ones shelling out thousands per month for the PPC bill.

When Google first came out with its PPC I checked out the minimum cost per click - at that time I think it was 15c. On high ticket items where your your conversion ratio is 0.05% - 0.1% then it just becomes an exercise of throwing more money at Google (and at the SEOs who promote this.

I have always been on page 1 of Google,Yahoo and MSN for my major keywords without having had to outlay a single cent. My results improved significantly when I was able to bring our selling price down to a more modest level. There was also an increase after doing a re-write of several key pages.

When the money-grubbing advertisers bring in a PPS ( Pay Per Sale) then I might have a look and consider it.

[eagent]

Originally Posted by craigmn3

Okay I am kind of up and down here on this issue.

IF you can organize your site to your keywords , and cater to your customer and get high Organic listings.....then there is no need to pay per click.

Perhaps I just don't understand the PPC mentality
but my organic listings are pretty high right now....here's hoping I never have to have a PPC mentality.

Hi Craig (and Tom! Nice to see you here. Let's party soon - I'll bring Irish beer;-).

As for PPC vs Organic: Listen, if I could get my organic results to happen instantaneously - and give me the feedback I need within a few days to see whether I'm on track, you bet that would be my most cost-effective and popular channel.

I believe what Janeth is saying is this:

1) PPC works if you develop your campaign in a targeted fashion, understand your visitors buying process and behaviors, and optimize your message.

2) Organic SEO can benefit greatly from a well-monitored PPC campaign. I find many interesting keyword/keyphrase results from watching my PPC campaigns. Then I create optimized pages with keywords pulled from my best PPC results. Its an iterative process.

3) As Tom says above: a multi-channel marketing campaign trumps a single-source campaign every time. And it's fun to be able to own more and more of your online real estate in this virtual Monopoly Game.

Here's to putting your pools on all my properties... especially Park Place.

best,
ME

P.S. I also share the same love hate-hate relationship you voiced regarding PPC. But it can be a killer partner if you allow it to be.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by simonm

Here's how I see it. Ignoring the actual landing page, a well positioned page - SEO in the top 3 or 4, will get between 25% down to maybe 10% of visitors searching for a particular key phrase, a PPC link will get maybe 3% click through for the same phrase.

BUT.. Those customers who eventually use ppc after 1st looking at the organic results will I guess be more commercially minded, by that I mean in a buying mode. The ppc leading the customer to a highly focused web page should have a better chance at converting than an SEO page which might not be the one I particularly want the customer to land on.

So, I would agree that ppc leads to more conversions per click through than SEO, but personally I would prefer to be No1 for the key term, though I usually aim to have a ppc advert for the sake of understanding the overall number of people doing a particular search.

Happy New Year

Simon

I wish I could have said it that well Simon and I agree that being ranked #1 for the key phrase a long with the PPC is the best way to go.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by kneelsit

The writers so far all sound to me to be touting for business but they are not the ones shelling out thousands per month for the PPC bill.

Can you show me any where that I said I do this for a living or that I want your business?

Check it out, I do website designs not SEO or PPC campaigns. Maybe the writer was trying to pass on something she has learned to try and help out someone.

Originally Posted by kneelsit

When Google first came out with its PPC I checked out the minimum cost per click - at that time I think it was 15c. On high ticket items where your your conversion ratio is 0.05% - 0.1% then it just becomes an exercise of throwing more money at Google (and at the SEOs who promote this.

I have always been on page 1 of Google,Yahoo and MSN for my major keywords without having had to outlay a single cent. My results improved significantly when I was able to bring our selling price down to a more modest level. There was also an increase after doing a re-write of several key pages.

When the money-grubbing advertisers bring in a PPS ( Pay Per Sale) then I might have a look and consider it.

You would only consider a pay per sale model?

So what your saying is if someone went to all the trouble to find customers, send them to you and you only had to pay if your website was good enough and you were able to make the sale, then you would consider that.

The other person is taking all the risk and you don't have to do anything and you would consider paying them. And we wonder why 90% of sites online don't make money.

[janeth]

Originally Posted by eagent

I believe what Janeth is saying is this:

1) PPC works if you develop your campaign in a targeted fashion, understand your visitors buying process and behaviors, and optimize your message.

2) Organic SEO can benefit greatly from a well-monitored PPC campaign. I find many interesting keyword/keyphrase results from watching my PPC campaigns. Then I create optimized pages with keywords pulled from my best PPC results. Its an iterative process.

3) As Tom says above: a multi-channel marketing campaign trumps a single-source campaign every time. And it's fun to be able to own more and more of your online real estate in this virtual Monopoly Game.

Thank you very much, that is what I was trying to say.

[craigmn3]

I am ALWAYS looking for cheer leaders.

I guess the point I was trying to make is that PPC is spending 5k a month on what I can do free at my number 2 spot on google and yahoo. The care freeness not withstanding

Organic Listings should be the number on goal of every SEO professional.

PPC should be left to fill a speciality role...IF you can get an organic listing.

It's a tool like everything else. It's the gravy on the meat and potatoes that is Organic Listings. It makes the meal more interesting but I'd hate to try and live on it.

[achronister]

I guess the point I was trying to make is that PPC is spending 5k a month on what I can do free at my number 2 spot on google and yahoo.

New product launch, new domains, etc. I can do that in a few hours with PPC and have immediate conversions. Not so with organic.

Organic Listings should be the number on goal of every SEO professional.

Not so. It's a balance between rankings, usability, and conversions. You can make a site rank number one on everything, but if it doesn't convert, then there isn't much point. PPC is a tool to find the right balance.

PPC should be left to fill a speciality role...IF you can get an organic listing.

So you should only do PPC if you can rank organically? That doesn't make any sense. If you can get a positive ROI with PPC, organic rankings would be icing on the cake. Obviously it can go the other way as well.