We just plunged in Google

Riverwalk · #1 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 05:51 PM

Our website just took a massive plunge in Google. We have been #1 or #2 for the keywords "San Antonio Riverwalk" for years. Can anyone tell me why this might have happened? Did we do something wrong with our optimization or something that Google frowns upon? HELP!!!!

greeneagle · #2 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:00 PM

You definitely have a boat anchor around your neck. I found you at #99 I'd like something in reverse SEO chronology, working from the most recent backward. Don't hold anything back, if you really want help.

Right away I see 12 iterations of "san antonio" in your keywords. That's probably just a venial sin though ***3X Max recommended there***

Be honest and give us some history here:
Dupe Content Sites?
redirects, 301s, 302s - everything!

Lay it out!

We will most likely find it if you don't, anyway.

Ken

Riverwalk · #3 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:11 PM

Ken,

Some of what you are asking is over my head. I don't think there is a duplicate content site anywhere. We advertise the San Antonio Riverwalk and have site sections that layout hotels, dining, entertainment, etc. I don't know what you mean by 301's and 302's.

I just took screen caps for a presentation the other day and we were where we normally have been. Thanks very much for your help. This is our business so it is pretty important.

greeneagle · #4 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:14 PM

You asked:

Quote:

"Did we do something wrong with our optimization or something that Google frowns upon?"

In simple words just tell us what you have done to the site in the last 4-6 weeks.

Ken

Riverwalk · #5 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:15 PM

I also see this code on our home page and don't remember it being there before. We maintain the site in MS Frontpage.

<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">

Could this be a problem? I don't know what it is.

Riverwalk · #6 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:25 PM

We have just done general routine maintenance. Put certain advertisers up and taken some down. We put up a page that had our Mexico vacation photos on it and it had a tiny link to it on the bottom of our home page (so friends could see them). We did some mock up pages for an advertiser but they were not linked anywhere on the site. We have just done normal maintenance. I don't I have touched keyword or description tags since then.

greeneagle · #7 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:28 PM

Riverwalk:

Quote:

"We have just done general routine maintenance. Put certain advertisers up and taken some down. We put up a page that had our Mexico vacation photos on it and it had a tiny link to it on the bottom of our home page (so friends could see them)."

There may be some possibility that you placed outgoing links (OBLs) to a "Bad Neighborhood"... that has the potential to drop you like a rock.

Care to list who you linked to?

Tell me you haven't engaged any of the "goofball" promoter services have you? "Let me get you 10,000,000 links tomorrow"! You haven't been flirting around in that district have you?

You know people get arrested or experience "arrested development" for that, right?

There are many diseases over there!

Ken

Riverwalk · #8 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:36 PM

Very interesting. They are all businesses. Our links go through Linkcounter to be tracked. Businesses would include, Riverwalk Plaza Hotel, San Antonio Hotel and Lodging Association, Fairfield Resorts and other tourism related businesses. We don't advertise any adult or unsavory businesses.

As far as links, we get solicitations to link with link farms but we never do it. We solicit links with conventions that are coming into San Antonio and we did that last week, but they link to us, not us to them.

weslinda · #9 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 06:42 PM

Well...the only thing I can see is that there is really some very large usage of San Antonio through the site. So much so that the flow of the site is overtaken by it. While you are shooting for that market. You may have over done it.

As Greeneagle is sharing, lots more info would be needed to know what content has been changed and other items like that.

Who knows, it could simply be a fluke in a data center. You could also write google and see if there is any bans on your site or anything like that.

isharli · #10 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 08:44 PM

Weslinda,

How do you contact Google? Our site has a similar problem and I have no idea what we did or how to contact Google (there does not seem to be a way on their pages).

thanks in advance for any help.

Laura

weslinda · #11 (**permalink**) 06-29-2006, 09:45 PM

First thing I'd do, is to check http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/, and then go from there.

greeneagle · #12 (**permalink**) 06-30-2006, 12:04 PM

Riverwalk,

You may try posting a request for a Site review in our Site Review Forum.

Explain your situation and ask if anyone can see anything that may help.

Ken

scanmonkey · #13 (**permalink**) 06-30-2006, 06:14 PM

I searched on "San Antonio Riverwalk" and thesanantonioriverwalk.com is coming up #1, your site has almost the same name sanantonioriverwalk.com is now showing #138 So that's kind of funny that you were #1 and now a site with pretty much the same name is #1

I believe that this drop may have something to do with BIGDADDY. Possibly some of your incoming links have been devalued. So do some research about BIGDADDY.

Quote:

Originally Posted by weslinda

You could also write google and see if there is any bans on your site or anything like that.

I won't suggest contacting googl* Perhaps if you send them a check for 50 million and explain your problem, they will send you a thank you note.

scanmonkey · #14 (**permalink**) 06-30-2006, 06:30 PM

Here's a good start for more info about BIGDADDY: Cutts Lets The "Big Daddy Cat" Out Of The Bag
http://www.webproworld.com/viewtopic...=63679&start=0

Riverwalk · #15 (**permalink**) 07-28-2006, 05:35 PM

I appreciate everyones help in addressing our issue last month. I thought I should let everyone know that almost exactly one month later, we have returned to our normal Google positioning. I did a number of things to clean up the SEO on our site, but I have a feeling that Google did something to return the results to what they were.

Has anyone else had a similar experience? Thanks for all your help.

incrediblehelp · #16 (**permalink**) 07-29-2006, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riverwalk

Has anyone else had a similar experience?

Yes you'll find 4-5 threads a day started about this subject:

"Where did my ranking go?"

"Why do I rank #566 when I used to be ranked #5?"

It is because ranking stability is not the same as it once was on Google. Rankings fluxuate throughout all Google datacenters now.

Also Matt Cutts has said before they "play" with algo adjustments on different datacenters, but to be clear rankings widely varying because of different regions/personalization/datacenters and not because of varying algo.

nipplecharms1 · #17 (**permalink**) 07-30-2006, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by incrediblehelp

It is because ranking stability is not the same as it once was on Google. Rankings fluctuate throughout all Google datacenters now.

Also Matt Cutts has said before they "play" with algo adjustments on different datacenters, but to be clear rankings widely varying because of different regions/personalization/datacenters and not because of varying algo.

Jaan, I would never try to contradict your knowledge but what you say here does not make sense to me. Please explain if you would. 30,000 foot level is enough!

Rank stability is the inverse? Not stable.
Rank fluctuates across datacenters.
Mr. Cutts said algorithms are adjusted across datacenters why? for some pervert’s enjoyment? Ok, to test different algorithms? Maybe?
"..but to be clear rankings widely varying because of different regions/personalization/datacenters and not because of varying algo."

what regional/personalization/datacenters? You did quote Mr. Cutts saying they do change algorithms across data-centers for some perverse reason. (Ok, to be fair, the preverse part was mine!)

The boy walked across the street because the boy DID walk across the street? Next thing is "Cogito, ergo sum." (I am thinking therefore I exist.)

Seriously, what am I missing?

I go back to my conspiracy theory.... Aliens killed Kennedy and they now have bought the controlling interest in GOOG! World domination.. and not even in Latex! LOL

Michael

PS, I am doing ok on Goizzle so I am just kidding! (are the aliens laughing? And how can you tell?) ;)

Steven1976a · #18 (**permalink**) 07-30-2006, 10:55 PM

We have gone through the same and returned back to normal on a lot of our search terms.

Webnauts · #19 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by incrediblehelp

Yes you'll find 4-5 threads a day started about this subject:

"Where did my ranking go?"

"Why do I rank #566 when I used to be ranked #5?"

LOL

MathsIsFun · #20 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 09:24 AM

I have noticed lots of fluctuations these past few weeks, after months of stability.

I lost ground on one keyphrase and jumped to number one on another. I didn't know whether to laugh or cry. Two days later it turned around, then I dropped on both. It has been so crazy I have almost quit worrying.

nipplecharms1 · #21 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Webnauts

Quote:

Originally Posted by incrediblehelp

Yes you'll find 4-5 threads a day started about this subject:

"Where did my ranking go?"

"Why do I rank #566 when I used to be ranked #5?"

LOL

Funny as these appear, they are not funny to the guy/girl this effects. Or is it affects?

Alternatives are what? Adwords? Overture? PPC? "You need better content...", "You need better IBL." That's a laugh! In a niche, where do you get better one way inbound links? Some of these niches have competitors that will not trade links or they are just Spam sites that go away after a month. No offense Ken et. al.!

It’s a conundrum Webnauts. Most of us are here, including this writer, because we need to know. Were this just a game or an academic discussion then things would be different.

MICHAEL... OFF THE DAMN SOAPBOX and go sell some sex! ...Body Jewelry.. I mean body jewelry.. (just wanted to see if anyone was paying attention!) :)

Ok, back to your regularly scheduled thread.

Michael

Webnauts · #22 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nipplecharms1

It’s a conundrum Webnauts. Most of us are here, including this writer, because we need to know. Were this just a game or an academic discussion then things would be different.

Michael I was not laughing about the writer. I was laughing about the post of incredible help, while he is pissed off with this topic. :)

nipplecharms1 · #23 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 01:08 PM

:) Sorry then. But Jaan is Jaan! Helpful yet aloof!

Wow, he is coming after me now? :)

I still love everyone here.

And I should not be questioning either of you as you both have offered me help in the past!

Michael

PS Ok he is not aloof!

incrediblehelp · #24 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nipplecharms1

Rank stability is the inverse? Not stable.
Rank fluctuates across datacenters.

Well when you check your rankings one day are they are in position #35 and then the next on #3...that is not as it once was. I mean that their is no ranking stability like in the past, but the truth is their is some sort of stability for some. Those that have Google personalization turned on can expect rankings to be stable on their own computers, but those that don't have it turned on can see rankings all over the place and those rankings wont even be the same as those in another city because of Google datacenter load balancing for all the queries they get.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nipplecharms1

Mr. Cutts said algorithms are adjusted across datacenters why? for some pervert’s enjoyment? Ok, to test different algorithms? Maybe?
"..but to be clear rankings widely varying because of different regions/personalization/datacenters and not because of varying algo."

Not sure why Google decided not to align all datacenters as they once did. I am sure it is not just to make webmasters mad. Maybe it is now to hard for them to do this? Maybe they don't want to do this? Who knows. I assume it has something to do with the direction they are going in "customizing" the SERPs for everyone when utilizing Google personalization and maybe even SPAM defense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nipplecharms1

what regional/personalization/datacenters? You did quote Mr. Cutts saying they do change algorithms across data-centers for some perverse reason. (Ok, to be fair, the perverse part was mine!)

Yes they have to test somewhere and they have said they roll out simple algo changes across sampling datacenters. This is what they did for Big Daddy, if everyone remembers. The rolled the new results out to 1-2-3 different datacenters before the all of them.

Everyone must realize results will change even more in the future and be very distinct for each user if people sign up for Google personalization. Google is trying to get results to match your personal settings and location as much as possible because this is essentially the best searching experience.

incrediblehelp · #25 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 01:56 PM

Also if their were no ranking stability where in the world does Google get off in listing your average position in Google Sitemaps? They have to figure that on most datacenters you do have actability with certain keywords. If not why even put this stat in Google Sitemaps?

Webnauts · #26 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by incrediblehelp

Google is trying to get results to match your personal settings and location as much as possible because this is essentially the best searching experience.

If I understood you right, I do not agree. I am located in Germany, but our target group are not in Germany. We operate internationally.

incrediblehelp · #27 (**permalink**) 07-31-2006, 02:04 PM

Sure it is correct. If you are searching from an office in Germany and using Google.de why would Google try to return German based websites near where you live? Like it or not they are headed in this direction.

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