Sandbox checking

[emils]

Can someone please tell me this.

If a new site can be found in Google for its own domain name as keyword, and even can be found in SERPs for some less competitive phrases, does this mean it is not sandboxed at all?

The reason I am asking this, is that we have several domains setup with a dummy page on them and a couple inbound links, 'resting' there in wait for the sandbox time to elapse. However, the strange thing is that all these new and almost new sites can be found in Google at #1 for their own domain name. They also can be found for different less competitive phrases from the dummy page. So they are indexed and responding to searches. Would this mean they aren't sandboxed?

I never truly experienced the sandbox on any of the sites i've dealt with (50+ of them) and I don't understand why other people are having a lot of troubles with that, and i never saw this.

All sites I launched did work from the very beginning and never entered a 'sandbox' period. I also have friends that are launching new sites often; they never experienced sandbox as well. Makes me wonder...

Could someone enlighten me, i don't know what to believe anymore about the sandbox theory.

[cbp]

Characteristics of a sandboxed site:

* site is on a new domain launched since around March 2004
* targeted keyword(s) are moderate to highly competitive
* most of the sites pages are indexed by Google
* Googlebot crawls the site regularly
* ranks well for non-competitive keywords
* ranks well in Yahoo! and MSN
* ranks well in Google for an allinanchor:keyword(s) search
* has at least a reasonable PR and a good number of backlinks
* site has reasonably good optimization (eg keyword density and placement), but its not over done.
* absence of anything known to get a penalty or ban in Google
* the site does not rank in at least the top 500 or so for its main keyword

[jacobwissler]

I started my sites in June and August 2004. Until January of 2005, I couldn't even get on the first page of SERPS for my company name. Then one Sunday night in early February everything changed, and I shot to the top for all my key words, and nothing on my page changed.

Call it a sandbox or whatever, the fact is that Google held me back until my site had been up for 6-8 months.

[jestep]

I am a 100% believer in the sandbox. I think the easiest way to tell is having good rankings in Yahoo and/or MSN and a high position using an allinanchor:keyphrase search on google. I would also say that if your are only in for 8 - 9 months, then you are lucky. Don't count on coming out on your 8 month anniversary. Just be patient and know that as long as you keep promoting your site and making it better, you will get out eventually.

[randy776]

I too am a firm beleiver in the sandbox, but I don't understand the inequities that appear to exist in terms of "getting out". I am certain that my site healthcaredegrees.net is a text book example of a sandboxed site.

We rank in the top 5 for allinanchor searches for healthcare degrees, healthcare schools, and healthcare colleges. We have a decent amount of backlinks, and a solid PR5 on the main page and PR 4 on most supporting pages. The googlebot crawls the site daily.

My problem is we have been the "sandbox" for 14 months and counting. If I search virtually any keyword, I can't even make the top 1,000. I get NO traffic from Google, and rely almost exclusively on YAHOO for traffic where we are very well placed is search results for all of our keywords.

My problem is 14 months seems like a long time. I have always heard estimates of 6 - 9 months to escape the sandbox. Why do some sites get out in a few months and my site has been mired for 14? AND, why do I see my competition get out much sooner and climb to the top of the results on the same keywords with less PR, backlinks, or content than I have. I have another site that was launched 2 months before healthcaredegrees ranks great for all keywords, with a similar PR a few more backlinks etc. One site gets 200,000+ google search click throughs a month, the other site gets 0. GO FIGURE!

I guess my point is I think the sandbox and algo is much more complex than any of us have ever been able to fathom in this forum. I honestly believe that for any google results that you can allege to breakdown and explain, I can find you 10 exceptions to the RULES. I am often amused when posters tell us:

"here is what is happening with google"

or,

"Obviously, you are in the sandbox, you will get out in 8-9 months".

HERE'S THE BOTTOM LINE:

Nobody knows!

[Ace]

Can we still check wethere our site is sandboxed or not with "keyword-dfdf..............."

[cbp]

No....

[Spectur]

I have one thought about sanbox. It is evil and stupid, makes it very hard to get listed in a timely manner; and there are no guidelines given to undstand what you must do to get the magic pass to exit the sand box...

Seems to me that the sandbox is design to get people to pay google to get listed.. Which in my mind amounts to antitrust when you state that listing is free then you just leave sites sitting for an undisclosed amount of time in limbo..


Just my 2 cents....

[xmx]

Originally Posted by Spectur

I have one thought about sanbox. It is evil and stupid, makes it very hard to get listed in a timely manner; and there are no guidelines given to undstand what you must do to get the magic pass to exit the sand box...

Seems to me that the sandbox is design to get people to pay google to get listed.. Which in my mind amounts to antitrust when you state that listing is free then you just leave sites sitting for an undisclosed amount of time in limbo..


Just my 2 cents....

Spectur,

I agree with you.

I have many sites created after March 2004, and they seem totally ignored by Google while work fine with Yahoo, msn and the other search engines.

It seems also to me that they are doing so only to increase their adwords incomes.

But probably I am wrong, and this has absolutely nothing to do with Google entering the stock markets...

[Artyom]

Originally Posted by Spectur

I have one thought about sanbox. It is evil and stupid, makes it very hard to get listed in a timely manner; and there are no guidelines given to undstand what you must do to get the magic pass to exit the sand box...

Seems to me that the sandbox is design to get people to pay google to get listed.. Which in my mind amounts to antitrust when you state that listing is free then you just leave sites sitting for an undisclosed amount of time in limbo..


Just my 2 cents....

Well, we do have sandboxed sites too. But I can not tell you either I believe sandbox is evel or not.

From my, you and other guys who are sandboxed right now point
of view it is evel.

From other hand, Google eagers to provide people with relevant, quality results. Well, here we are talking about commercial sites (otherwise we wouldn't be so conserned about being on the top) and how do you suppose technically to make a judgement if a site has a good quality or not? When you set some valuating period of time you let people to validate a site, to set inbound links for it and ultimately to give some mark to it.

this is my 2 cents.

[TechEvangelist]

The Sandbox clearly does exist. Thus far, the only new sites I've seen that I've seen that have not experienced it were using non-competitive keywords.

The best thing that you can do is to continue to gradually build content and links wait for the day for the site to emerge.

Randy, 14 months is much longer than the average wait for most sites. You may want to look for other site related or linking strategy issues. I've been seeing a Sandbox period of 5 to 6 months lately, but it used to be 3 to 4 months. I think it is getting longer, but 14 months is an excessive amount of Sandbox time.

[promoking]

I too have suffered from the dreaded sandbox, only as of late I have found several legitimate "backdoor" access to Google and ALL other top Search Engines "MSN, YAHOO, AOL, etc...

There has been much discussion about Blogging for Business, RSS, and Pinging - and it all holds up. I am able to get an entire brand new site (No inbound links, Page Rank, or Alexa Traffic, and Domain registered after 03/04) spidered, indexed, and often listed on the first page - usually in a matter of only a few days.

Not sure what the rules are here or I'd send you a link as I do not want to get into hot water over spamming the forum...

There are a few other methods as well.

Cheers,

[SEOforGoogle]

in reply to lalvir, if you think your site is in the sandbox, a method similar to the "-sdfsdf, etc" technique is to enter

allinanchor:keyword

to see where your site **will** show up once it's out of the **sandbox**

[incrediblehelp]

Just to add another "monkey wrench" to this discussion. I have a client that is in this "sandbox", but his domain have been around for years and has preformed on some keywords within Google before a redesign was done to his website. The redesign was done around November 2004. His domain name is www.teamlogocases.com I was brought on at the end of this redesign process and implemented new meta tags, content, website architecture and IBL's. Right now we are rocking the house on MSN and starting to make a large amount of traction in Yahoo. They are basically NO WHERE to be found in Google. Even for the most non-competing terms you can think of for his industry, his domain is not being found. I think it is simply ridiculous for even website redesigns to have to go through this "sandbox" waiting period to get back in. We also rock the house for most of his keyword terms with the allinanchor:keyword on Google.

We have even tried doing press releases and adding fresh content to get Google more "excited" about the website, but with no response.

Does anyone have any other ideas one why this client may be under performing in Google?

[charco]

I'm well and truly sandboxed...
I'm indexed
I'm online since about March 2004
I'm submitted since oct 2004
I appeared in the top 10 for my main search terms about Jan2005
I disappeared February 14th 2005 for all main keywords
I am no 1 in Yahoo and MSN for main keywords (IB chemistry)
I am found in google for obscure phrases in the top 10
But it says that I don't exist for main keywords
ok I'm f**#$ed

But what I came on to ask is "an allinanchor:keyword?"

yours

Truly hacked off with Googlie

[HHI_Golf_Guy]

Originally Posted by randy776

I am certain that my site healthcaredegrees.net is a text book example of a sandboxed site.

In my experience, not having decent rankings in 14 months is not a function of being in the Sandbox. MOre than likely, it is a function of your on page SEO (or lack thereof). Yes, Google still considers on page factors.

I took a quick look at the home page of the first site in your signature, and the first thing that I noticed was the overuse of the word "healthcare" on your homepage.

To start, I would take that word out of all of the State links on the right hand side of your page.

FWIW, I know that we have launched a number of new sites over the past year that move to the top five for competiive KW SERP's in Yahoo and MSN, but take 7-8 months to achieve those same results in G. It does not matter if we build inbound links quickly or slowly, it is still the same result. There is an aging delay with Google.

However, from many of the posts that I see on this and other forums, many site owners condemn the Sandbox for their poor SERP's, when in fact their site suffers from poor SEO, poor structure and navigation, or violates G's TOS.

[HHI_Golf_Guy]

Originally Posted by incrediblehelp

His domain name is www.teamlogocases.com I was brought on at the end of this redesign process and implemented new meta tags, content, website architecture and IBL's.

What about content? All of your anchor text needs to tie in to the actual content of the site. From what I can see - especially on the home page - the site has very little content.

Wht little content there is has been buried on the bottom of the page.

[incrediblehelp]

Originally Posted by HHI_Golf_Guy

What about content? All of your anchor text needs to tie in to the actual content of the site. From what I can see - especially on the home page - the site has very little content.

Wht little content there is has been buried on the bottom of the page.

Yes I totally agree with you, but this is at the clients discretion. I can only recommend adding more and where, but in the end if they feel it is not appealing to the end user to have more content then my hands are sometimes "tied".

One question why do you refer to on page text content as "anchor text" content? I would never refer to on page content as "anchor text".

[Artyom]

Originally Posted by incrediblehelp

We also rock the house for most of his keyword terms with the allinanchor:keyword on Google.

Hm...not sure what does it tell you? You mean by performing this search you figure out how much good anchor text links you have? I've just checked out the same for one of the sites I work on and it does perform quite well - at Top 5 at GG, but the site is at #170 by the same keyword I've used at allinanchor.

[randy776]

Originally Posted by "HHI_Golf_Guy

In my experience, not having decent rankings in 14 months is not a function of being in the Sandbox. MOre than likely, it is a function of your on page SEO (or lack thereof). Yes, Google still considers on page factors.

I took a quick look at the home page of the first site in your signature, and the first thing that I noticed was the overuse of the word "healthcare" on your homepage.

To start, I would take that word out of all of the State links on the right hand side of your page.

I am going to give that advice a try, as at this point I am willing to try anything! But, that page still meets all of the criteria outlined as a sandbox site. If we do a search for allinanchor:healthcare schools, we are #2.