Adwords Overbid = Lowered QS??

SemAdvance · #1 (**permalink**) 08-24-2009, 06:51 PM

Is it possible to overbid in Google Adwords and negatively impact your quality score??

Reason I ask is the bid simulator has the following for a keyword term

$0.25 = 13,300 impressions

$0.06 = 13,300 impressions

I was bidding $0.25 and in position # 2

I saw I could bid $0.06 and receive the same impressions and wonder if by overbidding, I hurt my QS and why my ads were only in position # 2 with what seems to have been the top bid and a good QS.

I have since adjusted my bid to $0.06 and will keep my on positioning.....

Would love to know if others have found this a possibility?

confettiguru · #2 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 12:27 AM

It is definitely possible to overbid but why
would that negatively impact your quality score?

deepsand · #3 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 03:07 AM

Google makes no mention of ones bid amount being an explicit factor in determining QS, and there is no evidence to suggest otherwise.

What Google does say is that being the high bid is not sufficient for being placed in the 1st position, that a sufficiently high QS, relative to other bidders, can result in your being placed above one whose bid is higher than your, with your still paying no more than your bid, and perhaps even less.

The intent of QS is simply to prevent those with either deep pockets or empty heads from simply buying the top position.

almer · #4 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 04:21 AM

Impressions could be the same.
There on the same page displayed simultaneously.
But CTR would be higher for higher position.
So bidding higher would probably be better for your QS.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

Cheers,

Almer

ogletreeseo · #5 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 05:10 AM

If you overbid Google will overcharge you. You can be the only person showing up for a term and they will still charge you close to your bid.. I have lowered bids in the past and kept the same position but paid less.

almer · #6 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 05:14 AM

True,

But in this case not true.
Quote: "I was bidding $0.25 and in position # 2"
If he is number two he won't be the only one showing up.

Cheers,

stephen186 · #7 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 07:30 AM

I guess if you bid higher, there is a chance you could be placed higher rankwise and in turn a good CTR, which should only add to your QS and not decrease it.

SemAdvance · #8 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 08:33 PM

I was thinking that they may think I am trying to scare others into not bidding as high as me. It is called "scare bidding" usually used by large corporations to scare off mom & pop advertisers mainly in the old Yahoo bid for position system.

Using some Google logic where under bidding earns a lower QS....perhaps then vice versa, over bidding might also cause a lower QS......

Just seemed odd.....

deepsand · #9 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ogletreeseo

If you overbid Google will overcharge you. You can be the only person showing up for a term and they will still charge you close to your bid.

Needs substantiation, as Google no longer publishes minimum required bids.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ogletreeseo

I have lowered bids in the past and kept the same position but paid less.

Without knowing the bids of your competitors, along with the QS discount(s) given your listing(s), there is insufficient data for drawing your conclusion.

LD · #10 (**permalink**) 08-28-2009, 06:34 PM

I've seen some competitors up their bids to $10 per click on terms I've used when even Google assess the value at $1 or less per click. Tell me that isn't scare bidding. I felt like uping my bids to $9 just to see them get charged $9.01 per click.

confettiguru · #11 (**permalink**) 08-28-2009, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LD

I've seen some competitors up their bids to $10 per click on terms I've used when even Google assess the value at $1 or less per click. Tell me that isn't scare bidding. I felt like uping my bids to $9 just to see them get charged $9.01 per click.

How do you know what your competitor
is bidding?

deepsand · #12 (**permalink**) 08-28-2009, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LD

I've seen some competitors up their bids to $10 per click on terms I've used when even Google assess the value at $1 or less per click. Tell me that isn't scare bidding. I felt like uping my bids to $9 just to see them get charged $9.01 per click.

In addition to the question reaised as to how you know what any other is bidding, understand that if that competitor has a high enough QS, they may still pay less than the next highest bid!

And, what do you mean by "Google assess the value at $1 or less"?

LD · #13 (**permalink**) 08-28-2009, 10:34 PM

Probably not the right term or explanation - It's been a while but while in the AdWords account and looking at the terms I had created, if my bid on the keyword phrase was too low, the tools would advise what I would need to modify the bid to ensure it would "show".

The advert isn't running at the moment so I'll have to go back into the account and reactivate to answer the questions properly.

deepsand · #14 (**permalink**) 08-29-2009, 11:40 AM

Walk away for a month, and who knows what you'll find when you return!

Gone are the explicit, nonsensical "minimum" bids that varied from day to day, with no discernible logical basis.

LD · #15 (**permalink**) 10-30-2009, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deepsand

In addition to the question reaised as to how you know what any other is bidding, understand that if that competitor has a high enough QS, they may still pay less than the next highest bid!

And, what do you mean by "Google assess the value at $1 or less"?

Finally got around to this: what I should have said is that the Adwords tool can assess why a keyword isn't "showing" and the result sample phrase looks like this..

Keyword
web development firms

Status
Below first page bid
First page bid estimate: CA$6.00

Max CPC set by me
(My bid)CA$0.65

I would assume that the OP bidding on this term are bidding in the range of $6.00 for top placement - all things being equal.

deepsand · #16 (**permalink**) 10-30-2009, 09:25 PM

Which AdWords "tool" do you refer to; the "Ads diagnostic tool," or another.

Google just recently changed the Campaign management features, again.

Not only have I never before seen a display such as the one you here present, but cannot presently find one either.

confettiguru · #17 (**permalink**) 10-31-2009, 12:45 AM

I'm attending the Google Adwords Seminars this week.
Hopefully this question will be addressed. I'll post when I get back
Having used adwords almost since day one, I feel like I need not only a refresher course but a
close look at the new features.
Is any one else here attending?

deepsand · #18 (**permalink**) 10-31-2009, 12:49 AM

I've passed on the opportunity to do so, strictly on the basis of the ROI not being sufficient for myself.

confettiguru · #19 (**permalink**) 10-31-2009, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deepsand

I've passed on the opportunity to do so, strictly on the basis of the ROI not being sufficient for myself.

I'm hoping my ROI is worth it. I live in California so travel time is minimal.
Deep Sand, I've learned a lot from you...do you attend any SEO events?
If so, which have been worth it and why?

LD · #20 (**permalink**) 10-31-2009, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deepsand

Which AdWords "tool" do you refer to; the "Ads diagnostic tool," or another.

Google just recently changed the Campaign management features, again.

Not only have I never before seen a display such as the one you here present, but cannot presently find one either.

In your AdWords account, look under Campaign Management, and click on the Keywords tab.

deepsand · #21 (**permalink**) 11-02-2009, 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LD

In your AdWords account, look under Campaign Management, and click on the Keywords tab.

The only such function present there is the "Ads diagnostic tool;" which, as stated, has never given me a display such as that presented by you.

Might it be the case that the AdWords administrative functions are different for Canadian users?

Or, that the results of said tool are data dependent, such that you've experienced a particular case that I've not?

deepsand · #22 (**permalink**) 11-02-2009, 03:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by confettiguru

Deep Sand, I've learned a lot from you.

Thank you for saying so; it pleases me to know that.

You should know that I too learn from those who ask questions. It is not uncommon for such to prompt me to do some additional research, so as to refine my response and/or provide citations, with the result that I come upon something that I'd not previously known, or to more deeply delve into something that I'd intended to, but not yet previously done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by confettiguru

do you attend any SEO events? If so, which have been worth it and why?

I quite some time ago ceased attending seminars, trade shows, etc., as I found nearly all to be long on sizzle and short on steak. The only notable exceptions were those which were very narrowly focused and run by the staff of the specific vendor whose product was the subject; such were highly technical & specialized in nature, relating to Operating Systems or major Applications Platforms, such as Databases, and were presented by the likes of IBM.

As the AdWords seminars should be narrowly focused, they do, if indeed run by Google employees, hold the possibility of providing more substance than I've found to be the norm.

Do let us know your evaluation of the experience when you've the chance.

LD · #23 (**permalink**) 11-02-2009, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deepsand

The only such function present there is the "Ads diagnostic tool;" which, as stated, has never given me a display such as that presented by you.

Might it be the case that the AdWords administrative functions are different for Canadian users?

Or, that the results of said tool are data dependent, such that you've experienced a particular case that I've not?

All I can speak to is what I see in the CP for this account and can't be sure if it's a geographical specific feature or not. I don't recall anything specific occurring that would lend to this feature's enablement.

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