Google Results - Ads or Non-Ads?

joliettech · #1 (**permalink**) 03-05-2004, 01:00 PM

We have recently started an AdWords campaign. After the Brandy update we were dropped to the mid 100's from the top 10 for 4 of our top key phrases.

It has become apparent that far fewer people click on the Ads than on the Non-Ad results. Which do you prefer, Ads, Non-Ads or which ever is more relevent.

I posted this in the Google forum and only got 3 responses, 1 for Non-Ad results and 2 for Ads only if I can't find what I want in the Non-Ad results.

aucomp · #2 (**permalink**) 03-08-2004, 07:14 PM

I would usually use the non add results, but are starting to lean towards the add results as my listing have dropped also.

I need to find a good way to get back up, is paying the only option left?

I have many 1 positions but can not get the one I want.

cooper · #3 (**permalink**) 03-08-2004, 07:51 PM

For me it depends on if I am searching for a specific product. If I am, I will sometimes visit sites that advertise on the right side of the results page. Otherwise I usually find what I want from the main search results. I rarely, if ever, click on the ads that appear "in the results" at the top left. They are usually the least likely to get me what I want for some weird reason.

I think it is worth it to use the PPC ads on the right side to pull in potential customers.

kneelsit · #4 (**permalink**) 03-08-2004, 09:10 PM

If I am searching for a particular topic I will tend to go for the web pages themselves rather than sponsored or the box ads to the right. Unless these ads are extremely well written and indicate in their description that they may provide the answer.

As for PPC I don't have the budget to waste money on these. Having been around since 97 and being always in the top 10 (often #1 or #2) for my major keyword phrases I feel that my exposure is alredy as good as it can be.

When Google adwords came out I did my sums and found that I would be losing money by trying them - based on the cost per click quoted by G. I need an average of around 1000 VISITS to achieve one sale. Being a high end product I am fairly happy with this ratio.

Pay Cost PER Click - never!!

TheWebDoctor(tm) · #5 (**permalink**) 03-08-2004, 11:06 PM

I just finished reading an article on a 116-year old company with an annual income of over $25 million. They stand on the success of PPC. Of course, any company with that depth of advertising budget can stand to weigh in for the cost of PPC. Additionally, their sales range from $500 to $3.5 million. They acquire 25 - 30 new clients per month.

But what people fail to state when talking about PPC is it is not an advertising medium for companies with a small budget.

Here's an interesting concept.

Businesses using PPC state that it is much better not be #1 in the PPC listings. So, if the business owner in position 1 comes to realize the fact that she's paying more than others with lower conversion rates, shouldn't she lower her bid? That would then force others to lower their bid until the costs are more managable.

Instead, stories of success have led many to believe that PPC is a good advertising medium. Therefore, less astute PPC campaign managers seek the first position driving the costs up. Many really good PPC managers state one should be somewhere in the middle of the pack.

I've read many times that about 5% of SE visitors actually click on PPC ads. In all my years I can think of two companies whose PPC I've clicked on and actually purchased from. One actually ended up paying at least 5 times for my one $447 purchase. Incidentally, their price was $150 off the regular price. I wonder how much they actually made on my purchase after 5 clicks.

I love word problems, so here goes.

100 SE visitors perform a search and only 5 click through a PPC ad and only 2% convert, how many visitors does it take to convert a sale? The cost of the PPC ad is, for a simple number, $1.00. What is the cost for the successful sale? Now, the markup on the item is $50, what is the end result?

It would take 50 visitors to generate 1 sale and the cost of the successful sale would be $50. The net result would be $0. To make the advertising worthwhile visitors would need to purchase more than one item to generate a positive income flow. This doesn't always happen and can't be a factor that can be counted on.

orthodoc · #6 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:30 AM

I never click on the paid listings in Google. I'm not interested in who paid to be there. I click on the result that appears to be most relevant to what I was looking for.

My own website is at the top of Google -- I think because it's been out there for years, and is the best site for anyone searching in my field. I have appropriate keywords, and a lot of traffic. I'm no expert -- I just have the right website in the right field (clinical massage therapy).

makeyoursoftware · #7 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:40 AM

Last Month we also carried out PPC Campaigns, We found Google was most difficult to handle in terms to get hits. being a small company it is hard to pay higher PPC of USD 16 or USD 6 which some giants do. At lower PPC it is really hard but search engnies like Kanoodle or enhance (ah-ha) & even the overture also provides better alternatives, even at low PPC. Just try some thing else.

makeyoursoftware · #8 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:41 AM

Last Month we also carried out PPC Campaigns, We found Google was most difficult to handle in terms to get hits. being a small company it is hard to pay higher PPC of USD 16 or USD 6 which some giants do. At lower PPC it is really hard but search engnies like Kanoodle or enhance (ah-ha) & even the overture also provides better alternatives, even at low PPC. Just try some thing else.

ppayne · #9 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 04:00 AM

I *almost* never click. I consider the poor person on the other end, paying $1-4 (gawk!) for my click. If I think I'm going to maybe buy, I might click, but most of the time if I think I'm just looking I stick with the free clicks. Poor blighters...

hunterweb · #10 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 05:31 AM

I seldom click on the ads, prefering to use the listing, and to be honest I don't know of any regular Google users that pay much attention to the little green boxes to the right hand side of the listings.

If the AdWords results appeared at the top of the "regular" listing I may be more inclined to use the link. I couldn't care less whether or not it is a "sponsored listing" or a "paid advertorial" or whatever, so long as it answers my question.

The green boxes to the right do not generate as much traffic as I feel that they should, mainly because they are not the immediate focus of attention - the listings are.

Mukul · #11 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 08:01 AM

I have always made it a point to click on the PPC ads and in fact I am now relying heavily on PPC engines as compared to organic listings.

The resaon is very simple. As a marketer myself I understand that the companies who are doing PPC have the following to be true:

1. They are trying to sell something so hard that they are paying for the people to see it. So I can always dig in to get some idea and I can know what kind of promotions they are doing. What price tweaks they are doing etc,

2. They are trying to increase their ROI, so I they might be working on treating their visitors better and its always profitable to get more ideas.

I too feel that getting at #2 is more profitable then being #1 in PPC engines becuase it receives less number of "waste clicks". Ofcourse, a general visitor may treat PPC listings same as banner ads and hence may avoid that. But with really thought out descriptions and titles for you ad I am sure you can grab their attention too.

Mukul

OneMoreBite · #12 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 09:49 AM

Amazingly, I do look at the ads now. Before I thought about using PPC myself, I never even saw the ads but once I started to read them, I find that more and more I will click, especially if the ad seems to state exactly what I am seeking.

What amazes me is how often those links do not work, or lead to a 404? That makes me wonder how many campaigns never bother to check the link and get charged for no results!

So, in a nutshell, I check the listings, then glance at the paid listings and click those as well, if they appear to fit the bill. Has anyone done a usability study that displays what happens in the "real world?"

Kathryn

fathom · #13 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 10:58 AM

While highly market dependent AdWords clickers tend to be in a buying mood versus information searchers in results listings.

It is important to realize that although "Adwords" tend to produce a very small average of search click through when compared to result listings - if you could compared sales conversions you would likely see adwords produce far more "immediate sales" than result listings.

Additional, PriceWaterhouseCooper did a study (I believe in 2002 - and at that time 90% of all online purchasing are conducted by 10% of the online market.

Thus should this be still true today (and I see little reason to believe otherwise) dividing results listing traffic by 90% should give you a fairly equal average.

It is also worth noting if AdWords have not pan out for you and results listings are lack-luster as well - the problem could lie elsewhere.

Simply put -- Sometime you really can't shoot the messenger! :-)

PumaSpirit · #14 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 12:14 PM

I am glad someone has posted this question, because I have lately been clicking on some of those google side ads. But only because they seemed to state in their ads something I was looking for. So far I have not once found good results doing so.

To my amazement though, I also have experienced some of those ads misleading. Just yesterday I ended up on a dating site (some sexy something or the other) instead, while looking for organizational software.

I have not been in the habit of clicking on those side ads before and I am not any closer now to using them more than before. (which was nil)

Unless.... to get a little "payback" for the "misleading" I am tempted to keep on clicking until they can't afford to mislead us anymore. : )
Talk about wasting everyone's time. But hey... it's their "dime".

To sum it up, I will stay with my search results on the main part of the page. Seems a better bet to me to find what I am looking for. Why try fixing something that's not broken (yet)?

Is there anyone else who has experienced misleading ads like that on those google side ads?

Curious George · #15 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooper

For me it depends on if I am searching for a specific product. If I am, I will sometimes visit sites that advertise on the right side of the results page. Otherwise I usually find what I want from the main search results. I rarely, if ever, click on the ads that appear "in the results" at the top left. They are usually the least likely to get me what I want for some weird reason.

I think it is worth it to use the PPC ads on the right side to pull in potential customers.

I agree with Cooper. My usage pattern is absolutely similar to his. I wonder how many users out there are like us? Is worth the extra $$ to use AdWords as a marketing medium if average Joe like myself is not using it?

Curious George

cooper · #16 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orthodoc

I never click on the paid listings in Google. I'm not interested in who paid to be there. I click on the result that appears to be most relevant to what I was looking for.

What if the paid listing IS the most relevant link to what you are looking for?
People advertise for the keywords you enter for a reason: to show up in the search results. Period.

Quote:

Originally Posted by orthodoc

My own website is at the top of Google -- I think because it's been out there for years, and is the best site for anyone searching in my field. I have appropriate keywords, and a lot of traffic. I'm no expert -- I just have the right website in the right field (clinical massage therapy).

You are a part of the lucky few. The PPC or other ads that people purchase keep your listing free and available to the general public by supporting the search engines. I honestly don't know how much of their income comes from PPC listings but I bet it's a substantial amount.

For some, PPC is the only way they can get listed on the first couple pages (top 10-30) because their target is saturated. Look at "real estate" as an example. That phrase is so heavily impacted, it seems practically impossible to break into the top 50 search results. And even if you do get in, you are less likely to stay there. The PPC ads are a sure thing in comparison. It would be interesting to see what the click-throgh rate is for someone appearing in the top 5 vs. the PPC ads. I am sure the "normal" results have a better response, but what's the ratio of "appears in listings" to "actually clicked on" I wonder.

allanp73 · #17 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:32 PM

I personally prefer to click on the natural listings. However, because of the filtering effects of Florida, Austin and Brandy updates the natural results are directories and junk for the most part, so I am attempted more and more to click the paid results. Sometimes these paid results work but generally I am dissatisfied. I think the sites that were possibly the most relevent and most content rich were sites developed by small mom and pop companies or SEO companies. These sites needed to develop the best content in order to rank high and therefore were actually excellent resources. However, these same sites are now filtered out of existance by Google. Generally these sites can't afford to pay for the ads on Google or know that the ppc model is not cost effective to bother. So my problem is how to find these excellent sites. I actually had problems finding the Orlando real estate board because a search for it turned up only irrelevent directories. Really annoying. I hope that Google gets its act together.

allanp73 · #18 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:34 PM

I personally prefer to click on the natural listings. However, because of the filtering effects of Florida, Austin and Brandy updates the natural results are directories and junk for the most part, so I am attempted more and more to click the paid results. Sometimes these paid results work but generally I am dissatisfied. I think the sites that were possibly the most relevent and most content rich were sites developed by small mom and pop companies or SEO companies. These sites needed to develop the best content in order to rank high and therefore were actually excellent resources. However, these same sites are now filtered out of existance by Google. Generally these sites can't afford to pay for the ads on Google or know that the ppc model is not cost effective to bother. So my problem is how to find these excellent sites. I actually had problems finding the Orlando real estate board because a search for it turned up only irrelevent directories. Really annoying. I hope that Google gets its act together.

emi_b · #19 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:40 PM

I have noticed that I will click on them, but I am more hesistant to do so. I know that poor guy on the other end is paying for me to view their homepage so I carefully read over the description to make sure that it is what I want.
I also click on any new competitirs to see what they are up to. For me it is usually the only way to see any new changes in my industry.
My main concern about this topic is that we are not the average Joe Schmo out there that is searching for widgets. Most of them don't even know what a sponsored listing is. (I know this becuase most of my clients, I have to explain it to them)They will click on anything. They are just wanting to get in and get out. In some of my google terms, I get better ROI than on a natural listing that I had to work for.

joliettech · #20 (**permalink**) 03-09-2004, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooper

People advertise for the keywords you enter for a reason: to show up in the search results. Period.

Exactly, that is the only reason we have an AdWords campaign. Until the last update at Google, we were doing fine. This is the best way to keep our name in front of the people we want to do business with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooper

It would be interesting to see what the click-throgh rate is for someone appearing in the top 5 vs. the PPC ads. I am sure the "normal" results have a better response, but what's the ratio of "appears in listings" to "actually clicked on" I wonder.

I would also like to see some numbers on this. I can tell you from our experience since we started with AdWords, based on the amount of impressions for the last week, the CTR for AdWords is 1.06% and the CTR for being in the top 10 of regular results was better than 10%.