I have benn advertising with adwords for several months and the cost per click for the keywords i choose started at £0.15, but now they are £2.50. This goes way past my budget and i wondered if anybody new why there has been such an increase in cost.

The keywords i am using are: discount codes, discount vouchers, promotional codes for a discount codes shopping site.

DISCOUNT HYPERMARKET - Shopping Portal with Free Discount codes, Promotional codes, Money off

I tried sending an email to google but i really do not understand what they are on about, something about the quality of the words.

Any help i would be more grateful.

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Moved to Google AdWords/Google AdSense

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I had the same problem promoting The Secret Diary of Adrian Cat - one minute I was getting hits for $0.10 nest they were demanding $10. Here is a discussion I had with them before closing my account.


>>>

Thank you for contacting Google AdWords. Please hold a moment while we route your chat to a specialist who will help you with your question: "Question regarding minimum bids.".
Nefertiti has received your message and will be right with you.
Nefertiti: Hello Stuart. Thank you for waiting. I'm happy to help you with Google AdWords.
Nefertiti: I understand you've a question about minimum bids.
Stuart: Hello - I set up a campaign and was number 1 position for several keywords with a bid of $0.10 - why are you now requesting a minimum bid of $10
Nefertiti: What would you like to know, Stuart?
Nefertiti: Due to the dynamic nature of search, a keyword's minimum bid is likely to fluctuate.
Nefertiti: However, if you find that your keyword's minimum bid increases often, this is an indication that your keyword's Quality Score is not strong enough.
Nefertiti: Can you please tell me which campaign you're referring to so that I can look into your account?
Stuart: Secret Diary > Group-1
Nefertiti: Okay
Nefertiti: Please wait while I look into this situation.
Stuart: I do not believe for one minute that people are bidding $5 for obscure terms such as "children's book cat"
Nefertiti: First, I'd like to clarify that the minimum bids of your keywords are not determined by your competitors' bids.
Nefertiti: Your minimum bids are based on the Quality Score of your keywords.
Nefertiti: I see that your keywords have a poor Quality Score.
Nefertiti: As a result, you see these high minimum bids.
Stuart: So what would attract a Good Quality Score for a children's book about a cat?
Nefertiti: Your Quality Score is determined by your keyword's clickthrough rate (CTR), relevance of ad text, historical keyword performance, the quality of your ad's landing page, and other relevancy factors.
Nefertiti: You can increase your Quality Score and lower your minimum bid by choosing highly targeted keywords and writing relevant ad text.
Stuart: Look I want to advertise a book - NOT take a degree in how to work with Google
Nefertiti: Also, consider deleting keywords that have accrued a large number of impressions and yielded only a few clicks.
Nefertiti: I apologize for your frustration, Stuart.
Stuart: Maybe better if I just advertise elsewhere - where it is simpler!
Nefertiti: I'm sorry for your frustration, Stuart. However, if you would like to decrease the minimum bids of your keywords, please consider the options I've provided above.
Stuart: What you have said does little to help - on one keyword there is a click through rate of 5% - yet you still ask for minimum bid of $20
Nefertiti: Stuart, please remember that the clickthrough rate is just one of the several factors that determine your Quality Score.
Nefertiti: I suggest that you try refining your keyword list by making it more specific.
Nefertiti: The more closely your keywords relate to the product you're offering, the better it is.
Stuart: Yes I understand that - It is far too confusing - I really just want to advertise books - not study Google's rules and policies etc etc etc
Nefertiti: I do understand, Stuart.
Stuart: So tell me how to get advertsising at around $0.10 - $0.20 per click
Nefertiti: Stuart, you'll need to improve your Quality Score to decrease your keywords bids. To do this, please consider optimizing your ad campaign.
Nefertiti: To start, you can refine your keyword list to make it more specific.
Stuart: What can be more specific than the keyword "book about a cat"
Nefertiti: For example, you can use the names of the books you're promoting on your website.
Nefertiti: This would make your keyword's Quality Score better since it closely relates to your ad text and your website.
Stuart: If people were searching for the name of my book they would find my website - I am trying to use Google to promote my latest books
Nefertiti: Stuart, I suggest that you use our Keyword Tool to refine your keyword list.
Stuart: I did!!!!!!!
Nefertiti: I just ran the tool for your keyword 'best cat books'
Nefertiti: And found that it has no searches.
Stuart: Most of the keywords came from running the tool
Nefertiti: Stuart, please add the keywords which have a high search volume.
Nefertiti: Also, make sure that these relate closely to your ad text and your website.
Stuart: Ah - like cats - which was originally $0.10 when I first added it - then jumped to $10
Nefertiti: Stuart, 'cats' is a very generic term.
Nefertiti: It doesn't closely relate to your ad text or your website.
Nefertiti: When a user searches for cat, several results are likely to come up.
Stuart: I have 49 keywords - ranging from generic to very specific - most started at $0.05 - $0.10 then jumped to $0.50 - $10
Stuart: there is no point in me using Google if clicks are > $0.20
Nefertiti: If our system determines that these keywords aren't performing well for you, it might raise the minimum bids.
Stuart: that's not a very useful feature!!! - Oh these are not doing well so I will charge the customer more!!! That's like a supermarket with goods that are not selling doubling the price!
Nefertiti: This is done to encourage advertisers to consider refining their keyword list by investing in better keywords.
Nefertiti: As you're aware, the higher the Quality Score, the lower you pay.
Stuart: I have 49 keywords - from general to specific - all are now to expensive - what more can I possibly do???
Stuart: Why not be really helpful - suggest 1 keyword that will be not more that $0.20 per click
Nefertiti: I suggest that you visit the following link to learn more about improving your Quality Score:
Nefertiti: https://adwords.google.com/support/b....html&hl=en_US .
Nefertiti: I'm unable to comment on the bids of a keyword since the process of determining the bids is automated.
Stuart: As I said earlier - I do not want a Degree in Google Adwords - all I want to do is advertise a book
Nefertiti: However, I can run the Traffic Estimator tool to see how a keyword is likely to perform for you.
Nefertiti: Stuart, I'm trying to help you.
Stuart: I know you are - but it is very frustrating that I spend time creating campaigns with google and withing days the minimum bid goes from $0.10 to $10
Nefertiti: I do understand your frustration, Stuart.
Stuart: So why not raise the issue with management for me?
Nefertiti: Stuart, this is expected behaviour.
Nefertiti: If your Quality Score is poor, your minimum bids will be high.
Nefertiti: You need to improve your keywords' Quality Score to lower your bids.
Stuart: But it is surely driving your customers away!!!
Nefertiti: We've found that this system works best for the benefit of our users and our advertisers.
Nefertiti: High quality ads benefit both users and advertisers.
Stuart: Well I realise that I have only a small budget and am of no significance to Google - but it does not work for me.
Nefertiti: I'm sorry you feel that way. I again encourage you to go through the tips given in the link I've provided. This should help you.
Nefertiti: Stuart, are you there?
Stuart: yes
Nefertiti: Is there anything else that I can help you with for now?
Stuart: Could you give me the URL for the advertising section of Yahoo's site? Looks like I need to find somewhere else to advertise.
Nefertiti: I'm not equipped with this information.
Stuart: I was using irony
Nefertiti: Stuart, I'd be happy to answer any other AdWords questions you may have.
Stuart: I know you have tried - but really you have not answered my questions - just given me the Google Blurb - so there are no further questions - thank you

Hm-mm; sounds an awful lot like some of my telephone & email conversations with Yahoo/Overture.

Perhaps they use the same call centers?

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Find other ways to market, and pick new terms, nothing you can do to shake up the big boys.

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Oh, how I truly feel the pain, understand the frustration of any discussion with Google's customer service. After similar experience, this is what I have to say:

So why can’t Google just sell ad space for x-dollars like a newspaper does? You know, your ad appears in the indexed category and/or subcategory of your choosing for x-number of days, hours, weeks.

A searcher could browse paid ad categories much like he would the want-ads section of his local paper, or he might query all categories by typing keywords that would trigger suggestions, e.g. that 17 matching terms are found in this category, 27 in this other category, and 2 in this other category. (A general search might trigger such an announcement also.)

If they simply cut all the cr....
Wouldn’t the playing field be even for all sites - new or old, rich or poor?

Wouldn’t that eliminate all the click fraud?

Wouldn’t that get rid of all these bogus sites full of ads and not much else?

Wouldn’t that eliminate all the confusion about keywords not performing to Google's liking?

Wouldn’t that eliminate the need for the (obviously) outsourced annoyingly useless, seemingly uncaring customer service?

Wouldn’t there be a whole bunch of happy repeat customers?

Wouldn’t that just be the right thing to do? You know, like living up to their moral platitudes?

Just a thought...

The idea behind using multiple factors for scoring the ability of a specific keyword to send a qualified lead to a product information page is to make a level playing field.. in terms of visitor satisfaction & purchasing satisfaction of the person buying the keywords.

Knowing the major factors helps tremendously in using words which the automated system believes are accurate. One of these is ensuring that the keywords you bid on are also used in the ad text.

Google AdWords Quality Score Factors Demystified » eWhisper.net

That will help with minimum bid prices. Also, Google builds a history on your account, and past performance also matters.

As for ad position: "According to Google, the things taken into account for position are Max CPC, CTR, Keyword to Ad copy relevance, & Keyword to Search relevance. When you're talking minimum CPC: it's CTR, Keyword to Landing Page, and Keyword to Ad. I think weighted in that order."

Understanding Factors for Google AdWords Placement and Quality Score

10 Ways To Increase Adwords Quality Score

In many cases for valuable keywords, competitors will raise costs by bidding more.

Kevin

Bear in mind that AdWords is supposed to be an auction.

1) That competitors might increase their bid is functionally irrelevant to the issue of the minimum bid for that keyword. If such is a factor considered by Google, then that is owing to greed on their part.

2) Google does not consistently set so-called "minimum" bids. I have seen numerous instances where newly added keywords, sometimes even entire ad groups, are immediately inactive for not meeting the "minimum" bid. With no changes having been made to any of the bids, it is not uncommon for such listings to become activated by Google!


In short, Google is a whore.

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Especially to apwade and stuart6mac: I'm not trying to defend Google nor attempting to discount your sense of frustration, but I'm reminded of the cliche that "we are underlings" -- and this is perhaps one of the truths when it comes to the relationship between we mere mortals and the Google Gods.
In any case, if your per click rates are going up, there are a number of reasons. The main one is certainly rooted in the supply and demand situation: the more people bidding for a given keyword (or expression), the more the price will rise. But, just as likely, there's the Google built in idea -- whether you like or agree with it or not -- of encouraging you to work on what they call your Quality Score. Nefertiti's explanations may seem (and no doubt are) difficult to understand, but, if you'll allow me to say so, she's telling you what you need to hear, even though it seems to not be what you want to be told.
Nevertheless, she's undoubtedly correct in suggesting that if you want to see your cost per click go down, your answer lies in pushing up the focus/relevancy of your keyword(s). For instance, while you may think that "book about a cat" is sufficiently specific, you have only to realize how many of its kind exist. It has to run in the hundreds or even tens of hundreds, so why should Google's favour shine upon you? You're simply one of a fair sized crowd, are you not?
Not being aware of your product or its content, to say nothing of the exact wording of your AdWord or the precise choice of keyword(s), I can't begin to suggest where the potential improvement lies. However, if I'm to be teased by your ad, my click on it needs to be triggered by a whole lot more than "a book about a cat." I need to be intrigued about connecting with a cat that talks to people, a cat that loves mice, a cat that can count up to 555, a cat that has 19 lives rather than the usual nine ones, etc., etc., ad nauseum. In other words, I want to be told by your ad that "Heh, here's something you don't know / may not be aware of / can have you laughing your head off / bursting into tears / etc., etc., ad nauseum."
In other words, you gotta be different and stand out from the crowd if your ad is to pull the way Google thinks it should. Think about this, really think about it, and then have the courage to recognize that the fault lies not with Google, but with you (and other frustrated souls) because, ahem, we are underlings!!

Duncan

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Thanks for all the comments, I changed my ads and keywords last night and the cost per click did reduce to £0.50, which really is to expensive. I was empressed with adwords initially, but now i donot get as many clicks per impression they have pushed the cost up so they can make more money.

This is it not really good business sense in my opinion as it drives clients away!

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This still begs the question as to why the minimum bid should be different for different advertisers in an auction system.

Such is clearly discriminatory. What cogent argument is there for the justification for such?

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"This still begs the question as to why the minimum bid should be different for different advertisers in an auction system.

Such is clearly discriminatory. What cogent argument is there for the justification for such?"


Simple...Google displays ads with the user in mind...not the advertiser. If someone wants to advertise with a crappy irrelevant or poorly worded ad, they will pay more for that privilege and hopefully be discouraged from said practice.

I cannot believe there is a defense for the Google revenue systems - whether it is Adwords or Adsense…unless you are caught up in this shady way of making a living. Their system is wide open to scams and fraud, is stupidly complicated, and has caused the internet to flood with worthless sites running page after page of ads. There is no doubt in my way of thinking (which tends to be honest and forthright - and ethical) that this system has only Google in mind - not the searcher - that is for certain. It has become more and more difficult to get to what you are really after when doing searches for specific items. Do you pay attention to what comes up for ads when you are trying to find something specific?

I think if I was a searching for a children’s book about a cat - which I’m guessing does happen, I certainly would be delighted to see Stuart’s ad pop up with just the words he expected me to use.

Why does Google need to worry if Stuart’s ad does not appear very often? Is it taking up space in the Cosmos? Is some other ad waiting to take Stuart’s ad’s place? For goodness sake, exactly how much does it cost Google to store Stuart’s ad until someone types in “book about cat”. Stuart was as exacting as he could be to avoid wasted $$’s on worthless clicks. Makes perfect sense to me.

The Google system exists for Google - and because of these sleazy methods, the internet has been inundated with worthless sites full of advertising and rant with fraudulent clicks.

And we’re back to my original question:
So why can’t Google just sell ad space for x-dollars like a newspaper does?

There would be potential problems with this idea.

For example, Google sells a small advert that links to the site of the advertiser. Ad space in newspapers would not be the same as ad space on someone else's website.

And selling advertising space in newspapers is NOT as simple as you might think.

For example, everyone does NOT pay the same price for the same amount of space in a newspaper or magazine advert.

If someone specifically wants -say- fourth right hand page, they would pay a massive premium for that. But if someone asks for an advert ROP (Run of Paper) because they don't care where it goes, they'll pay less.

And if the advertiser who specifies the fourth right hand page suddenly pulls out at the last minute, some poor soul in sales will have to frantically phone round their contacts trying to sell that space at a hefty discount.

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That fails to address the question re. the minimum bid & ingnores the fact that, like any publisher, Google has editorial control over both the acceptance of the listings & the content of the ads.

Furthermore, as I've earlier noted, Google's "minimum" bids for a give keyword for a given advertiser change from day to day, with no action on the part of the advertiser.

I've seen numerous case where a) the keywords were proper in all regards; b) the site's content was wholly relevant to said keywords; c) the amount bid was low enough so as to guarantee a low position in the display list; d) the "minimum" demanded was far above the current market for said keyword; and, e) the advertiser left the bid unchanged, with the result that, within several days, the listing was activated by Google.

Google's actions re. "minimum" bids are clearly arbitrary, capricious & discriminatory. Were their's a regulated industry, they would be exceedingly hard pressed to defend against an equity suit claiming such actions on their part.

Google's actions are not taken for the pleasure of the "user," but rather for that of Google. That is the primary objective of any business.

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Newspaper want ads are simple - simply go on line, fill out a form for a heading and text, and pay for it, usually for the number of words (space used). The "link", so to speak is the phone number or other contact information. There are usually bargain rates for certain categories, and higher rates for others like real estate. There are even "Thrifty" sections for items of lesser value. Often, if you pay more, your ad will appear in more than one publication widening its distribution.

Display ads are priced per size (column inch), page location, and page area - a whole different matter, but also not a difficult price structure and it is a UNIFORM price structure, although regular advertisers can get better rates. Normally, the standard rates are published, so there are no surprises. These are usually contracted terms and although one can pull one's ad, the bill still must be paid.

I'm simply saying that if no one calls you, perhaps no one likes what you have to offer, or no one is impressed by your ad. If you don't get results, you the advertiser, not the publisher, dictates any changes necessary, and the publisher does not arbitrarily make the advertiser pay more because no one looked at your ad, or someone looked at your ad but did not call (link to) you.

Although newsprint publishers do have a published Rate Card, their rates are not fixed, but are in fact negotiable.

It is this fact which gave rise to Google Print Ads.

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To oiboi and those of like mind:
SisterSledge hits the nail on the head when she observes "Simple...Google displays ads with the user in mind...not the advertiser. If someone wants to advertise with a crappy irrelevant or poorly worded ad, they will pay more for that privilege and hopefully be discouraged from said practice."

The point you're not recognizing, oiboi, is that YOU are attempting to compare apples with apples when the reality is that GOOGLE is preoccupied with sorting out apples, oranges, lemons, etc., etc. No two ads (or, at least, very few that on the surface seem similar in nature or purpose) are truly comparable. They all have Quality Score differences and THIS is what governs Google decisions.
With all due respect, if you aren't prepared to look at things from Google's point of view -- as opposed to your own -- you're going to continue being frustrated.
With even more due respect, perhaps you should give some thought to the old saying that "There are none so blind as those who will not see."
Yes? Yes!!

Duncan

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What you say sounds nice in theory; but, in practice, that's not what's happening.

Please see my prior posts re. Google's arbitrary, capricious & discriminatory behavior re. "minimum" bids; i.e. they are not consistent even from day to day re. the same keywords, the same ads, and the same advertiser! That's apples & apples, oranges & oranges, artichokes & artichokes.

Google is in business, for their gain, not that of the "user." Their goal is to maximize their revenues, by any & all available means.

"In theory, there's no difference between theory & practice; in practice, there's a world of difference."

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A little off topic, and no disrespect to you Stuart, but your line there frustrates me a little.

Google Adwords isnt some kids toy that you can just put a few dollars on a day and sell your book 100's of times over within that budget. Its a professional system that makes some people (through Adsense) thousands of pounds/ $ a day.

It seems like you arent willing to put the effort in to learn little bit about it. A few hours reading a night for a week and you would have a firm grasp of how to get results using it. People and many on the board would charge 100s and 1000s for professional PPC services, and for good reason, they know what they are doing.

Sure there are flaws to it and it could be set up better, no question, but its still a tool that can bring huge traffic and sales to most sites. It certainly could be set up easier for new businesses and people to market their product but once again this isnt some second rate shop corner shop.

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"Google is in business, for their gain, not that of the "user.""

But that is true of every business. Or at least, it should be. If anyone follows a different paradigm, then they are not in business. No matter what they might think.

The way some people look at adwords/adsense is as if they go into a bakery and say to the person behind the counter:
"I'd like a bunch of bananas, please."
"I am sorry, we do not sell fruit, we are a bakery."
"What's that? You don't sell what I want to buy? What a way to run a fruit shop!"
"But sir, I have already explained, we are not a fruiterer, we are a bakery."
"Well, OK, if you don't sell bananas, I'll have a pound of apples."

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I, for one, am certainly in business for my own gain or at least livelihood, and certainly expect that Google and any one else should make a profit - a hefty one if possible. However, in any industry, even the advertising industry, there are ethics, and it seems to me that Google-style internet advertising has gotten totally out of hand, so much so that there really isn’t a heck of a lot left of anything else but ads when you are trying to find a specific item on the net. I believe that Internet advertising should be a huge industry and that a lot of $$ should be made from it. However, Google-style internet advertising is run unethically and has all but ruined the internet. This profit is made at the expense of the users getting decent search results and definitely at the expense of the advertisers who would like to (and have a right to?) get through to their prospective customers (the users) quickly and promptly.

I guess, yes, I must be too blind to see it from Google‘s standpoint, since what I can envision from that imaginary powerful position is an easier, totally ethical means to make a ton of money, and in the process, clean up the internet a whole lot…which is what Google professes to have as a main goal.

To say that Stuart’s ad is bad is incorrect. In fact, it was way too good. His ad was painstakingly targeted to the audience that he wanted to reach. I ask again, if he had no competition for these keywords, and he was getting useful Click Thrus from his small but targeted audience why should Google get more money? As Deepsand puts it, how can they, just because they can, make price changes in a manner that is “arbitrary, capricious, and discriminatory”? It’s like they told Stuart, “Hey, smart guy, those hits your getting from your well-targeted ad are making you some money, and that’s not fair, so we want half of it. Either you give us a huge chunk of those sales, or sign up to pay us more money the Google way - via irrelevant keywords that result in useless click thrus.”

Seems to me, if they expect a minimum payment per ad, then they should just say so and charge it up front and allow advertisers to reach exactly whom they want.

As an aside, I am finding this discussion very helpful and informative. However, I think perhaps it would be more beneficial if viewpoints were clarified by whether the contributors are ad publishers or advertisers. I can stay on my high horse because I don‘t publish ads, don‘t make my living that way - would though if methods were different. I do okay making/selling tangible goods - business has grown mostly by word of mouth - good products, ethical, liberal business policies and practices. I would be ashamed to run this type of advertising on my site. I do buy advertising - just a wee bit, and would purchase Adwords pretty regularly if it wasn’t such a rip-off, and I do a heck of a lot of SEO. I do almost all my purchasing via internet. I rarely click on ads and am totally disgusted by the number of useless sites cluttered with ads.

I publish several sites. I am pleased when adverts relevant to my websites appear on them.

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