Windows Firewall was murdered

[Dinghus]

It was killed by IE7. True story. The built in firewall with XP Pro was working (but turned off) when I attempted to load IE7 (forced to by the autoupdate grrrr).
Well, IE7 would not talk to the internet. I checked all my firewalls (72 million of them but I'm not paranoid or anything JUST KIDDING!) and turned them all off including Windows Firewall which had been switched on by IE7 installation I'm assuming.

Still no talking to the internet. So I called MS and the first thing the help desk guy wanted me to do was turn off all firewalls. Here comes the kicker, I now receive an error message when trying to open Windows firewall. It says there is an error and can not display the control panel. Hmmmmmmmm

MS Solution? nuke my harddrive and do a clean install. My solution? Remove IE7. IE6 still works but can not get to a number of MICROSOFT sites. I'm thinking it is a firewall problem.

So the question comes to me, how do I shut off the firewall since I can't get to the controlpanel? I'm sure there is something in the registry but I can't seem to find it. Anybody know?

[craigmn3]

Okay this one is a little out of my league, but I think if you access your task manager (ctrl + alt + del) then click on the processes tag and find the firewalls running and click the suckers off.

[iowarth]

Have you tried http://support.microsoft.com/kb/920074? This seems to address the question of how to get the firewall controllable from the Control panel. And there is another approach at http://www.techspot.com/vb/all/windo...-firewall.html

Good luck

[Dinghus]

I already tried the task manager route and even the remove windows software route, but you can't do either.

However I had never seen that one article at MS. Their help desk guy didn't know that one existed either. But it looks like I was right about it being in the registry.

Have to give it a shot and see what happens.

[webmaster@pinecone.com]

Won't doing a system restore from a date prior to your IE7 update fix this?

[bj]

Why does this not surprise me?

I had to install FrontPage to work on a client site today. When I fired it up and started importing a site it froze. Tried again. Froze again. Then I finally got it going. So I get the site up in the program, need to open help to find out how to do something . . . and it opens my default browser? Which is firefox. (why would you need a browser to look at help files? sheesh.) At which point my Comodo Firewall kicks off a warning that Firefox is trying to do things at Kernel Level and This Is Not A Good Thing. So I shut everything down and reboot . . . only to find out that not only is Firefox no longer my default browser, but I also can't get on the internet with it. So I open Opera, and find out all my cookies are killed. *sigh*

I haven't been this pissed since a so called security update from Microsoft installed that insecure piece of manure called MSMessenger without my permission.

When is MS going to realize that this kind of nonsense is making Ubuntu and other Linux distros look MIGHTY ATTRACTIVE????

[artemist]

Elementary my dear Watson

Start, run, type "services.msc", select "Windows firewall" Click "Stop"

[Orion]

I'd recommend trying Registry Clean Expert... seems like a good product.

I did not have your exact problem but had quite a few cummulative 'bugs' from the past year with XP and it seemed to solve a ton of them!

[artemist]

I used to use these freeware programs. But after a dozen reformats I decided enough is enough and took control of my own hard drive.
Now my registry is locked, nothing dumps itself on my hard drive anymore without I say Yes.
Bill himself is locked out
Rule XP, and you rule the World.
Vista. What a load of dogsh1te!!
Please note. I am not a cumulative poster. I only open my keyboard when I think I have something useful to contribute.

[Clint1]

Originally Posted by artemist

Elementary my dear Watson

Start, run, type "services.msc", select "Windows firewall" Click "Stop"

Dingus, don't just click to stop it, you may want to set it to "Disabled" or "Manual" as per your requirement. Also it can be listed different ways under XP's Services. It may be "Application layer gateway" or "IPV6", something like that depending on what updates you have installed.

This is yet another reason why I never trust M$, nor their products. I won't be using IE7 for as long as I can avoid it. There's already patches out for it now, incredible.

[deepsand]

Originally Posted by Clint1

Dingus, don't just click to stop it, you may want to set it to "Disabled" or "Manual" as per your requirement. Also it can be listed different ways under XP's Services. It may be "Application layer gateway" or "IPV6", something like that depending on what updates you have installed.

This is yet another reason why I never trust M$, nor their products. I won't be using IE7 for as long as I can avoid it. There's already patches out for it now, incredible.

"Application Layer Gateway" and "IPV6" are services quite different from "Windows Firewall/Internet Connection Sharing (ICS)," which is the service that you need to address.

Within the General sub-panel, you need to both Stop the service, in the Service Status area, as well as change its Startup Type to Disabled.

[Clint1]

Originally Posted by deepsand

"Application Layer Gateway" and "IPV6" are services quite different from "Windows Firewall/Internet Connection Sharing (ICS)," which is the service that you need to address.

Within the General sub-panel, you need to both Stop the service, in the Service Status area, as well as change its Startup Type to Disabled.

ALG is part of the firewall: "Provides support for 3rd party protocol plug-ins for Internet Connection Sharing and the Windows Firewall". I don't have that IPV6 on my PC, but when I've seen it on others I seem to remember it having something to do with the firewall. Yes: http://www.networkworld.com/news/200...-firewall.html

What I said is correct--he may have to stop only one or all of these services, depending on which one is causing his issue. There also may be some "dependencies" between them.

[deepsand]

Originally Posted by Clint1

ALG is part of the firewall: "Provides support for 3rd party protocol plug-ins for Internet Connection Sharing and the Windows Firewall". I don't have that IPV6 on my PC, but when I've seen it on others I seem to remember it having something to do with the firewall. Yes: http://www.networkworld.com/news/200...-firewall.html

What I said is correct--he may have to stop only one or all of these services, depending on which one is causing his issue. There also may be some "dependencies" between them.

No, ALG is not part of Windows Firewall; rather, WF is dependent upon ALG; that is a distinction with a very important difference. And, it should not be assumed that no other applications, present or future, are or will also be likewise dependent.

Therefore, only the Windows Firewall service should be disabled.

If that fails to solve the problem, shutting down other services is not the way to proceed. In that case other measures, such a using Recovery Console to do a rebuild, or a non-destructive re-install are in order.

[Clint1]

Originally Posted by deepsand

No, ALG is not part of Windows Firewall; rather, WF is dependent upon ALG; that is a distinction with a very important difference. And, it should not be assumed that no other applications, present or future, are or will also be likewise dependent.

Therefore, only the Windows Firewall service should be disabled.

If that fails to solve the problem, shutting down other services is not the way to proceed. In that case other measures, such a using Recovery Console to do a rebuild, or a non-destructive re-install are in order.

WF has no dependencies on ALG, only RPC (and WMI RPC). ALG has no dependencies at all. The only point I'm trying to make, that you fail to understand, is that it could be EITHER of these. If shutting down one doesn't work for him, he should try the other one, or both. Shutting down either of them will cause no issues (other than affecting the Native FW of course).

[deepsand]

Originally Posted by Clint1

WF has no dependencies on ALG, only RPC (and WMI RPC). ALG has no dependencies at all. The only point I'm trying to make, that you fail to understand, is that it could be EITHER of these. If shutting down one doesn't work for him, he should try the other one, or both. Shutting down either of them will cause no issues (other than affecting the Native FW of course).

Dependencies vary by installation. For example, at the moment I am remotely working on a machine which shows that WF is dependent on both Network Connections and Windows Management Instrumentation (WPI) - which is different from what you seem to have observed on another machine - while ALG shows no dependencies. On the other hand, the client in front of me shows ALG being depended on by Internet Connection Firewall.

The bottom line is that it cannot be said as a generality that disabling ALG is a viable course of action on all platforms and with all applications. All of the service interdependencies on the machine in question must be checked before merrily beginning to shut them down. And, even if shutting down a service or services does fix the problem of the moment, there is no guarantee that such will not cause a different problem in the future.

If a system is so badly corrupted that one needs to begin disabling multiple services the better course of action is to rehabilitate the OS.

[Clint1]

Originally Posted by deepsand

Dependencies vary by installation.

And that is what I have been saying!! Each setup can be different!

The bottom line is that it cannot be said as a generality that disabling ALG is a viable course of action on all platforms and with all applications.

And I NEVER said that!

All of the service interdependencies on the machine in question must be checked before merrily beginning to shut them down. And, even if shutting down a service or services does fix the problem of the moment, there is no guarantee that such will not cause a different problem in the future.

And I NEVER said anything to the contrary!! Dude you need to read posts more carefully.

Now let's recap what I have said:
Dingus, don't just click to stop it, you may want to set it to "Disabled" or "Manual" as per your requirement. Also it can [as in "could", "may be" "might be"] be listed different ways under XP's Services. It may be "Application layer gateway" or "IPV6", something like that depending on what updates you have installed [i.e. "depending on the installation"!]

And:
.......he may have to stop only one or all of these services, depending on which one is causing his issue. There also may be some "dependencies" between them.

I grow weary of arguing semantics.

If a system is so badly corrupted that one needs to begin disabling multiple services the better course of action is to rehabilitate the OS.

(Hopefully rhetorically) How can simply temporarily disabling a Service, something that takes only 2 seconds, and can also be reversed in 2 seconds, be a worse "course of action" that "rehabilitating an entire OS" which could take days and may NOT be reversible??

[deepsand]

My point was that the Firewall and AVG, etal., are not synonymous; and, it may therefore be necessary to try disabling any number of combinations of services, with the result that, unless he both knows what he's doing and keeps track of where he's been, he may not be able to find his way back home, ending up with a machine with more problems than he started with.

[Clint1]

Originally Posted by deepsand

My point was that the Firewall and AVG, etal., are not synonymous; and, it may therefore be necessary to try disabling any number of combinations of services, with the result that, unless he both knows what he's doing and keeps track of where he's been, he may not be able to find his way back home, ending up with a machine with more problems than he started with.

Why do you try and find conflict where there IS none!!??? That is what I have been saying all along!!
The only point I'm trying to make, that you fail to understand, is that it could be EITHER of these. If shutting down one doesn't work for him, he should try the other one, or both. Shutting down either of them will cause no issues (other than affecting the Native FW of course).

[deepsand]

Originally Posted by Clint1

<snip>

Shutting down either of them will cause no issues (other than affecting the Native FW of course).

That's the problem; shutting down ALG may adversely affect other services and/or applications.

[Clint1]

Originally Posted by deepsand

That's the problem; shutting down ALG may adversely affect other services and/or applications.

On XP Pro SP2 (et al I'm sure), ALG has no dependencies. And, as I have been saying all along; it takes 2 seconds to disable it, then 2 seconds to re-enable it if his specific setup "doesn't like it" being disabled.

I give up.

[deepsand]

Having just noticed that it's been 17 days since Dinghus asked for help, and we've had no feedback from him as to his progress, it occurs to me to ask why we're even still here.

Unfortunately, I find this lack of followup by the supplicant to be the norm, even on the sites frequented by the hardcore techies. It seems that most of them never consider the fact that their feedback may be useful in the future to others with the same or similar problem.

[Clint1]

Originally Posted by deepsand

Having just noticed that it's been 17 days since Dinghus asked for help, and we've had no feedback from him as to his progress, it occurs to me to ask why we're even still here.

Unfortunately, I find this lack of followup by the supplicant to be the norm, even on the sites frequented by the hardcore techies. It seems that most of them never consider the fact that their feedback may be useful in the future to others with the same or similar problem.

Now that's for sure! Good point.