Looking at the latest news it seems to me that the digital revolution is accelerating.

1. What does it take to have an eBusiness?
2. Can cinemas, tv etc in the long run compete with media delivered over Ip?
3. What do you require to have an online bank aside from legal permission? Will our children use online or traditional banks?
4. Will the next real estate crisis be related to overinvestment in buildings for some companies that can be driven more cost effective with less real estate capital?
5. What is the effect on relative prices and inflation (general price increases) of this transformation? US whole sale prices fell 0.4 % in september. Volume (demand) also decreased.
6. Will (online) free trade or protection win in the long run?
7. Other Kw's: Digital art, distant learning, distant consultancy, etc.

The transformation from reality to virtual reality goes fast

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And ths post proves why we make nothing in the US anymore... And because of it the economy is going to hell in the hand basket....

Take your hands off the keyboard and get your hands dirty and you won't have the same attitude....

Because service for service for service is not an entropy free system!!!

If you believe kgun's premises then I lump you in with the masses.... and I also strongly believe PT Barnum's statement there is a sucker born every minute. Only in todays virtual world maybe that should be there is Newbie losing his shirt every nano-second! LOL

Sculpt a statue, cast a table base, paint with oils, work on a motor, knit a sweater, play real world poker with real chips looking in someone's eyes.... do something real and you will feel how foolish this post is.....

If kgun is true then this joke is a sad note on the state of the world....

Renee Descartes was on an airplane.
The flight attendant came up and said "coffee, tea, or me?"
He looks at her states "I THINK NOT!" and disappears.....

I rest my case by now getting off line to go finish sculpting a triple tree trunk table base (which I will post pictures of and sell copies of after it is done)...

I encourage you all to do something real!

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A few less posts kgun and maybe you could get outside.... and see how nice the wind and rain feels on one's face....

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I agree in part, that the digital revolution is accelerating...

however...

We have seen Hollywood turn out record breaking box office receipts in the last few years.. People will still want to go out, face it the Theatre experience kinda blows away what we can do in our homes. Besides most of us aren't hermits lol.

Rental business??? Well that's another story, Our major video / game rental companies in Canada (block buster / rogers) have already stepped up to the plate (as it were) and now offer online rental services. I've heard rumours that will be morphing into actually renting streaming vids online (which of course we'll all soon be able to watch via our computer on our big screen plasmas and lcd tv's.

I know very very few people that actually visit a bank branch anymore. They are still there but by far they are in the minority. There will always be small bank locations to go and talk, and of course as it is now the majority of their in house business is not daily banking but loans, mortgages and investments. Canada has had nation wide banking and ATMs since I was a kid, I can remember even as recently as the 80's going to the USA and having a bi*ch of a time trying to find a bank machine to withdraw funds...

Anyway... I don't feel the digital revolution will change what we do.. but it will change how we do it, in the long run, to the benefit of the masses.

We can all hope for free highspeed wireless blanketing the planet though! =o)

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I don't understand why some people think that working in the digital world somehow makes us less "real" as human beings. That's foolishness. Computers haven't stopped us from communicating with each other (which is what makes us human)...on the contrary...email, forums, and blogs nurture that important part of our humanity.

The best part about the digital world is that it reduces the absurd, ridiculous waste of resources that we are used to wasting...like using gasoline to drive to work, to the bank, to shop at the mall.

It seems kgun's questions are more toward a developing way of doing business rather than a problem caused by greed.
So far, all I can see is a change from the necessity of a brick-and-mortar retail store to electronic shopping. We are exchanging our time and gas for UPS shipping charges.
The same goes for virtual products that can be downloaded or information that can be transmitted. Really, what is changing other than the mode of purchasing?

As for manufacturing and sales of real goods, are we not already in a global exchange? NAFTA was not the result of the Internet. Even WalMart tried to sell only American-made products but had to quickly convert. Our gripe about the demise of a non-virtual marketplace has more to do with what we want our salaries to be at. Five bucks an hour doesn't get it any more for us, and that has forced manufacturing of real goods overseas. We voted for that with our purchasing preferences.
I sell caps and visors. We offer American-made hats, but nobody wants to buy them because of the price.

While it is an established economic principle that the service business does not create economic wealth because you are not creating anything, nevertheless, that is balanced by the extending of our economic borders to a global economy, which in turn, balances the equation. Now it is not a matter of national economics, but one of global proportions and interdependance.

No, I don't like it either, but that's the way it is going. And digital ecommerce is making it possible by eliminating the old warehouse/distribution methods and the reliance on physical location.

It is not me driving this revolution. I am adapting. And the title was provokative. Note there was a storm on the machines in the industrial revolution. It is difficult to stop evoution.

Today Google announced better than expected results.

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Agree to that. Like ther traditional paper news paper will live, but constantly decrease its share of the market. A lot of Norwegian news papers have had to go online and fire people.

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I think you could mark it as a digital revolution on your calendar. Good counter-cyclical keynesian economic thinking!

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Yes, it makes production more cost efficient.

Profit = Gross income - costs.

If an online and offline shop have the same gross income per employ, but the costs are lesser for online shop, the offline shop may go bust. And it is an advantage for the consumer.

I think a part of the present crisis is due to this evolution. We are in a transition economy that will last for years.

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As far as I understood Kenyes he was for a free enterprise economy and government intervetion in a periode of market inefficiencies.

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Exactly.

The price level is much higher here. We buy a lot from the USA on eBay. I don't think many of you buy much from Scandinavia. But now it is relatively cheap on Iceand. So if you like wild nature, fishing and outdoor life, Iceland is not too expensive to visit for a holiday.

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Kgun, IMO, you are dead on as far as the digital revolution is concerned. IMO, in N.A. this is not by choice! It is driven by the fact that manufacturing is dying a quick and painful death. A direct result and benefit of the digital revolution is my telphone bill has gone from $400+ to 29.99/mo. Increasing productivity (same service at a lower cost to me). IMO, the drop in oil prices will be short lived and as the cost of energy increases the digital revolution will become more important as a way for families to make ends meet.

The N.A. economy shift to online/service from manufacturing is receiving its first test. The biggest test and toughest is the protectionist winds blowing in from the south (I'm Canadian). US politicians talk the talk but... when push comes to shove they are ultra protectionist and walk the free trade walk like drunken sailors on leave. The softwood lumber dispute all but killed the industry in Canada and enabled big US companies to gobble up Canadian companies for pennies on the dollar. So the "free" in free trade is a joke when dealing with the US.

The biggest test for the digital revolution will be there are not enough "qualified" engineers and IT people to meet the needs of the infrastructure required to shift to a digital service economy. In Canada this is a problem that is easily fixed if only the "media" and unions would shut up and realize jobs go to China, Brazil and India for a reason. The unions killed the "auto industry" now they want billions to keep it alive. Man... stick a fork in it! Its done! Re-train the workers for the digital world or let 'em flip burgers! They should be the choices not my tax dollars propping up a dead industry for the third time. Three strikes and your out!

The whole global banking fiasco is the direct result of greed and free market abuse with the knowledge the US citizen would pick up the tab. Profits were privatized and and losses socialized. The current situation pretty much sums up the 20th century US financial system. Mortgages with no credit check and more importantly due diligence ie:no/inadequate property appraisals! We'll know the global financial system collapse has come to an end when the FBI is doing the perp walks that follow every financial calamity in the US. I gotta' believe the CEO of Countrywide will be the first of many.

Google beating expectations shouldn't surprise anyone here afterall it's a rigged auction (Quality Score) with NO COMPETION! and therefore people are falling all over themselves to bid higher for a diminishing inventory of "qualified" buyers due to the consumer led recession which is taking hold.

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We started this revolution years ago, it is just starting to surface. As soon as our kids are able to sit up we put them in front of a computor. Programs were designed to teach them everything from ABC's, reading, counting, math etc. They learned to communicate with friends at school via email then chat rooms now texting. We now carry the web with us wherever we go on our cells. Everytime we need something we reach for the keyboard. I can't tell you the last time I used one of those big heavy phone books! Idiscontined the newspaper because it was always yesterdays news and full of useless ads. This younger generation who started using computors at young ages are now homeowners. The first place they turn to when shopping for a product is the web, weither to purchase or get info.

The more connected we become the more people are needed in the as you call it "Service to Service Areas". Today we have more job options available to us than the generation before us. Yes it has become extremely difficult to find a brick mason or a carpenter to do good work. But our parents who were masons and carpenters sent us off to college so we could choose a better lifestyle.

Beacause we have such a large consumer base in the US we are very diverse. What difference does it make if a product comes from China as long as it is of good quality? We wanted cleaner air here in the US so we enforced strict air polluntant emmissions on our factories. For many factories faced with the costs of complying with the Federal regualtions on clear air found it much more cost effective to go to China where they had no reguations and the labor was cheaper. Now China is the worlds biggest pollutor and the air blows accross the ocean to us. Did we get our cleaner air?

As far as sitting at a computor earning a living I put in more longer days and weekends than I did when as you would say "Worked for a living". Ebusiness is long hard hours with many employees in programing, customer service and warehousing. I just hired 2 more warehouse persons this week. I now have 63 employees all full time and no layoffs with extremely low turnaround. Many companies are still having great growth. If unemployment hits 10% it sounds horrible but 90% are still working and have the money to spend. If you offer the right product they will buy it.

The housing crises was caused by greed and no we should not bail-out wall street or back up the banks for making bad loans. Proof is how AIG is still waisting money (again in todays news) after receiving bail out money. They caused this problem and should be held accountable for it. When we bailled out the airlines after 9-11 that was different because they didn't cause the problem. Housing prices rose so quick the market had to adjust itself. Years ago before many of you could remember there were 4 gas stations on every corner. Now maybee 1 and 3 drug stores or fruit markets and flower shops in their buildings. We can still find gas after all the stations closed. The market adjusted itself. We have too many banks. Every shopping strip has at least two, malls up to 4 etc. They even have braches in our grocery stores. Its just time for the banking industry to adjust itself. Today the big boom is building drug stores because the baby boomers are getting older and will need more drugs. Here in Cleveland Ohio we have a major dug store on every corner. This market will bust and adjust itself. The stock market had record growth in the past few years, it is time for it to adjust itself.

Back when records were recorded on vinyl (LP's) and CD's came out thousands of people lost their jobs, but thousands more were created making CD's and more records sold. Now that industry is being threatened by pirates, free down loading and blue ray technology. Our markets always adjust and we adjust. We are Americans and we are strong.

Sorry I sometimes get long winded.

I have to agree with this post all the way. Even though the whole world may be evolving into using computers for so many things we should use them for it doesn't mean any of us don't want to go swimming in the summer and make snow-forts in the winter...

It's awesome that we can reduce waste or using up valuable resources but the scariest thing about the digital revolution is the sexual exploitation of woman and children on or for the purposes of the internet. And it seems no one is talking about it enough - or trying to increase the world awareness of this sickness!! And trying and convicting the perpetrators of these serious crimes is as much a rarity as the finding and arresting them. (and please don't try to tell me it's not ONLY going on on the internet - that's a given)

What the heck's going on?

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Exploitation of women and children existed long before there were computers or Internet. Most of those exploited women would be on a street corner if they weren't being "exploited" on the net. At least on the net the pay is better, there are no pimps and the women are much safer. As to the children well... pretty much the same sickos using a different medium to trade their sickness. To blame the net for that is like blaming auto makers for drunk driving!!!

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So true, has happened and will continue to.. the part that seems to ALWAYS get missed is that these people aren't homeless out of work etc. Industries get replaced, they change, and new industries are born to replace the old ones.

100 to 150 years ago people were (for example) farmers, masons, smiths, cobblers etc. (oh and they all worked for themselves lol). Now a day, all those things are done totally differently.

The BIG difference in today's Information age is that where industries took one to two generations to fade back and be replaced (100 years ago) our generation is seeing whole industries be born die and replaced multiple times in our lives. Take the music industry... born during our parents (well mine anyway) generation, it gave way in our generation to 8-track tapes (born died), cassette tapes (born, died), cd's (born and starting to fade), mp3's...

When I started school (70s) we all thought that we'd eventually graduate, get a job and work there for the rest of our lives, however by the time we graduated college or university (end of the 80s) we knew that we should expect to have up to 7 different careers. it's not like this was sprung on us over night.. we all knew it was coming.

A challenge? Definitely! Exciting times? You bet!

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Speed of light, the market crash reminds of an adage for those of us who were around at the birth of all this technology. "To err is human, but a computer can really screw things up."

One thing we will see regarding electronic transactions is better and more thorough monitoring and regulation.

Rich, even before this current wave of technology, we didn't have to "make something" to "make something."

The Declaration of Independence and the Constitution are just words. John Lennon's "Imagine" is just an idea.

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Terry Van Horne:

Very interesting answer. This answer is written in Opera on my left screen. Ordinarily I don't use Opera when logging into WPW, because I have to delete previate data. That implies reduced efficiency (but increasing security). I hope that browser will not be bought by a US company like Fast was. On my right screen I have overlapping windows (will have three screens on next upgrade) one with my seamless internal homepage where I surf and browse for information. In the other window, I am also logged into WPW with IE 6.0 (that is better than later versions for my business). There I read this tread better than quoting. To your posts:

Relative prices must not be mixed with the absolute price level (general prices) which increase measure inflation. "Acellerating" price level is an increase in the inflation rate. Today we can observe big relative price swings. Relative price swings are important in a dynamic economy, since an increase in the (wage) price of labour relative to an increase in the interest rate (price of capital) carries information. In addition, an increase in the wage of engineers and nanoscientists relative to an increase of wages for teachers (who needs teachers in the digital / internet age? - a teacher that reads this thread can answer. My daughter's 4 1/2 years old daughter can soon read and write. She has learned to use a computer. You don't have to ask her to do it. There are some very pedagogical online programs for children in Norwegian. When she is 6, she has to go to school and most probably her learning decelerates when she has to learn English from a Norwegian teacher) moves resources from one profession to another. It will be painfull for some people, and there will be a "storm on the machines".

Links: Consumers 2

Related linksfor the student:
http://www.klenow.com/RPandRP.pdf

http://www.econ.umn.edu/~tkehoe/papers/USRER.pdf

http://mises.org/journals/scholar/Keeler.pdf

Relative Prices and Relative Prosperity

I am not so sure. In my view the transformation to a digital economy that has just started, will put a downward pressure on so many prices that it may end in deflation (a decrease in the price level). As written in another post above, it will also decrease the need for gasoline for some consumers and producers. They can do the business / shopping online. There is also a good supply of online entertainment so if you will save gasoline you don't need to drive to the cinema, and it may be free. Who said that the government has to solve the green house effect and the related problem of global warming? Mr Market, the digital and the nano revolution may do it better and faster. Today Mr. Market is about to introduce financial socialism globally for a shorter or longer periode of time.

Protectionism is dangerous. If the developed conuntried generally and the USA (a military that is estimated to be, if it gets a real treath, as strong as the sum of the next 22 strongest nations in the world) specially had used 1/5 of their military expenditures (what do you expect of homo sapiens? - I am not Joe Plummer) on developing poor countries and populating space, I could have written this post from an exclusive moon hotel. Some missing papers of Archimeds's have been found. Some scientists say that if those papers had been found when he lived, man would now have lived on mars. Have you heard that for some disabilities and some form of sickness it will be an advantage to live on the moon. It can make life more comfortable and as such improve life quality and prolong your life. Free trade is my ideal model. There are a lot of theories on international trade, one classic, being the theory of comparative advantages.

And there is a strong tradition among Scandinavians / Norwegians to spend money, like drunken sailors.

As I told above, there are many different theories on international trade. One, modern, less known, is the theory of demand for products distinguished by place of production (I know more than Google or use wrong KW's. I could have searched for Armington, an economist from IMF's research department). Armington's papers are not recommended reading unless you have a course in simultaneous dynamic equation models. A dress (physical good) produced to 1/10 th or less of the price abroad. USD 1000 in AdSense (digital Ad good / service) income for a years work. I could earn more on one weeks fishing (671 Mb video if you can / are able to stream / view it). Don't you know? Google AdSense incomes are better for some developing countries than our 1 % of GDP in aid to those countries. Mr. Market fix it again.

My opinion of what is happening. The USA are years ahead of other big nations (India may be an exeption) People from India are so lucky that English is a natural language for them. What is happening there is a large transformation and adaptation to a much more efficient digital and virtual economy. The USA will win this big poker game

But be careful, Mr, Market is in a bad corrective mood of Grand SuperCycle degree. (Easy to find that link. Page Search (CTRL + F) on delicious social bookmarks is much faster than looking in my bookmarks sub --- sub-folders).

It is the beginning of the digital and the nano revolution (a static replication (instance) of the whole internet at time t on my mobile camera / phone, is that possible?)

Note: A static replication may know less than a meta SE that may know less than Google that may know less than me. And I have an extra net where BOTS are excluded (so long).

Diagnosis: I am only sub paranoid.

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davidmg Exellent input.

Do you know what is happening here? Some days ago 350 billion NOK's (about USD 60 billion) were used in a country with 4.6 million inhabitants to bail out our banks. Who do you think take the money in this phase of the financial crisis?

Interest rates are not lowered, even if the Prime Minister and the Govenor of the Central Bank have reccomended that they do so. The bank employees sit there in their large buildings giving bad advice to A (that category gets a cup of coffee and a cake), B, C... clients. This is the biggest poker game of all time. I am not a socialist or communist, but neither a market turbo capitalist nor a Laissez-faire ultra liberalist.


It will be more secure. This

[
0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0, 0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0, 1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1, 0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0,0,0,1,0,1,0
]

can represent an unique digital USD that can be owned and used only once and then destroyed.

Digital signatures and digital goods will become more secure than physical signatures and goods. It is a bear market with large transformations and lot of opportunities if you take a bottom up in stead of a top down view of the world / economy. And it is the start of the digital revolution.
Yes, see my last post above.

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Real life chaos is ugly.

It has been said that mathematical chaos is beautiful. Mathematical chaos "mean life and opportunities", but it also explain natural evolution and change much better than any science I personally know of. So this transformation may even go faster and faster for a while, (depending on what part of the attractor the dynamic system visits). This thread is posted in the break-room. I did not put it on WPW's front page).

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I will use my money at the wrong time. The USA / India will win

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Yes, sitting outside, taking a cup of coffee, I know the GoogleMapBOT(Difficult function here) view me. When will (S)he offer me a piece of (the digital) cake?

GooglBOT has promised not to be evil, so I have no reason to fear Mc Cain (if he becomes USA's next president - nothing surprices me over there). Google have promised to be nice, so there will not be a geostationary satelite with a ... (this is not an online digital STARWARS game). Was that a funny story? It is the break-room and I am still subparanoid.

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I have a Master's in Compiler Design and Computer Graphics and Undergrad in CS / Applied Math.

I am saying with the authority of someone who should know from many years experience- Yes working on a computer IS LESS REAL. You all know it..

look at these simple examples:

When you have to actually have to talk to someone face to face you need to be civil, if you flamed like on the net you might get your teeth knocked out.

You don't have pedifiles getting away pretending to be kids on forums and con artists can't send a trap to 10 million people in one blast!

People posting fake profiles or product shots which can easily be verified by a quick glance.

A guy 500 lbs and on a respirator can slam dunk, but he doesn't really know how it feels, to practice hours upon hours in a gym and choke in other situations, And the win over the other team doesn't really bring him fame and glory.

And if you don't have a 3d printer or CNC machine that rebuilt carburator for a lambourgini won't do a thing to get your broken little rice burner of a car to move with out burning oil!

..............

Sure continue to delude yourself.....

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A man hour is a man hour.

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hehe.. for me one man hour takes two or three to actually accomplish LOL

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